GSDCA Lawsuit - Letter of Clarification from the AKC - Page 8

McKown you asked and I deliver ... I believe the 2011 USCA Nationals with a Roetemeyer clan slate of inner circle judges comes to mind .. T. Floyd with his import dog and his apprentice with Banga von Floyd Haus were either fined for not being loyal to Roetemeyer and his vision of world dominance .. depending on spin you could also say O'Kane got bonus points for being a loyal servant of Roetemeyer.  Do you really think people don't see this stuff going on and do you really believe we ever forget it ???  A one point win for O'Kane with a 289 over two T Floyd dogs finishing 2nd and 3rd tied at 288 with three Roetemeyer judges doing the honors.  This was the prequel and warm up to the 2013 WUSV qualifier big fix as Caputo did obedience in 2011.  I guess if it worked once why not do it again but with more of the same.  I would agree that T Floyd is what GSD breeders should be but he has gotten short sheeted many times for not being a loyal follower of Roetemeyer's shining path to total US GSD control.  We ( and I mean all GSD owners in the USA not USCA ) need a lot more T. Floyds in the GSD world and it concerns me that he is always getting the goob by the political party in control.

a link to the judges page  ..http://www.uscanationalchampionship2011.com/judges

I have friends in the AKC who have been long standing. and the depth of there association with biting sports is minimal at best there are still a large majority who dismiss it completely. Example, Our local 4H program has a dog club all breeds are welcome but in big letters in the hand book "No dogs with protection or Schutzhund training allowed" They follow a AKC protocol ! I,ve had my dogs there even helped several kids with there obedience but im looked at like a leper.

@Bob Mcknown, I'll use your earlier above statement as an example. 

There is a way to get these 4H kids out to your club to train, assuming they have a GSD, of course.  How, you ask?  Simple, offer the HGH.  If you are involved in 4H, you should have absolutely no trouble procuring the large number of sheep and land needed for the event.  4H kids would instantly understand the concepts within the HGH herding program AND its a breed survey level title to boot.

If the above is cost prohibitive, get them training on the BH and leave out the bitework foundation, so they can move on to OB, tracking or something else your club offers.

There are people who do just the titles you mentioned. But Schutzhund can,t become just a Agility trial AKC has that covered. There is nothing wrong with a smaller more unified orginization I,d rather have a thousand devoted members then a million people playing. That keeps the knowledge pure!  

@Bob Mcknown, Ever heard of the phrase "getting your feet wet"?  Clubs need these other titles to ferret out those whom WILL BE ABLE TO HANDLE the IPO/SchH regimen.  Those not cut out for it will stick with OB, FH etc, those whom have "learned the system" and have the desire can then move on to high drive dogs and IPO/SchH titles.  If the AKC went with your line of thinking, they would discourage people whom are only interested in doing the CD title because they aren't currently showing the ability, time commitment or interest to earn the UDX immediately.  Can't you see how preposterous this kind of assertion sounds? Once again, you're claiming "all or nothing", when it is simply not the case.

I'm completly aware of the titles offered by the Orginizations.

@Bob Mcknown, Then start offering them at your club.  I always ask the visiting German SV judges if they can work these other events, not being offered in USA trials.  I have yet to hear any of them say that they are not certified to do so.  In fact some of them find it strange that we don't offer them.

The solutions are there, but peoples eyes and ears are closed.

Booboo,

Were you there in Kansas City in 2011? I was. And, I have video of a good portion of the performances. Do you?

Have you ever seen any of the performances? Doubtful! You're just bored again and decided to come play, let's see who we can annoy today.

I don't know why you posted the part about dogs in 5 gen pedigree not being from before 1978.

Again, you are full of crap! My dog has eight in her 5 gen pedigree that were born before 1978 and I am sure many other people have at least one, if not more.

Regardless, what does this, or anything you have written, to do with what is being dicussed?

Mom:

              Every thing you just mentioned is offered at all trials that I know of with the exception of the HGH. One of the USA clubs I train with has several hearding instinct and herding seminars a year the Club President has about 60 sheep!

Bubba you post conjecture and opinion.You never post any thing that proved any of your wild rants and accusations.  Still wearing that tin foil cap I see. 

Every thing you just mentioned is offered at all trials that I know of with the exception of the HGH.

You have seen clubs regularly offering the STP1-3? 

You have seen clubs regularly offering the RH-L?

Same goes for the RH-W, RH-T and IPO-FH?

You also glossed over my mention of VDH events.  For example, look up the Turnierhundsport (THS).  This would be a great event for any USA venue.  It could be a real draw for new folks whom don't know anything about FCI and need to "get their feet wet"

One of the USA clubs I train with has several hearding instinct and herding seminars a year the Club President has about 60 sheep!

Was it using the FCI-HWT rules?  If so, which club was that?  As far as I know only AHBA has explored this (BTW, they recently joined the AWDF as guest members)

Momo,

I do see many clubs offering the STP1-3.

The others I do not see often, except for some clubs do list "All Titles Offered."

My question to you is, How many people do you know of that actually want to do any of these other things?

What is the big deal about an IPO-FH? It is just two FH-2's on consecutive days.

I agree that it is good to get more people interested in dog sport in general and all of the organizations can do a better job of promoting what they are doing.

At the end of the day, however, there are only so many people that are going to participate. The U.S. is not a country of dog sport people, so far.

How about if we ask Susie how many people at Schutzhund clubs in Germany are doing STP1-3, RH's, and IPO-FH's? I am curious to know if the participation levels are much higher there.

You also mention other VDH events. Are you asking that UScA become the new AKC in the U.S.? UScA is a club only and it was founded on Schutzhund being the primary focus, not a bunch of other sports.

Bob, there's no reason to drag my choice of headgear into this....

McKown .. the fact that O'Kane and the three judges that gave him a 1 point win over T Floyd's dogs in 2011 have served together and plotted together for many many years on the USCA and AWDF rotating carousel of leadership should in "no way" bring into question their possible conflict of interest or favoritism for O'Kane.  Just a little "home cooking" as we called it in basketball when playing on the home court.  

" How about if we ask Susie how many people at Schutzhund clubs in Germany are doing STP1-3, RH's, and IPO-FH's? I am curious to know if the participation levels are much higher there. "

Most of us don´t even know the rules of the new fancy titles...

Still growing are agility and obedience, but not many German Shepherds involved yet - that´s the playground for the pet breeds. Some UPr´s, FPr´s, SPr´s just for fun for the specialists and the youth, almost no herding ( we are a small country ), IPO - FH almost only in over-regional competitions, not many people involved in RH ( and the people who are involved are ACTIVE, not looking for a fancy title ).

I´m with Bob, there don´t need to be that much competitors, the trialing should be about quality, not quantity.
No trials/no proof  = no breeding = fewer pets looking like German Shepherds.

" Ever heard of the phrase "getting your feet wet"? " That´s true, but  it´s not about the kind of trials, it´s about attitude. On your side of the pond people have to pay a fortune for a PUPPY, they have to pay for the trainer, for the helper, for the club... - Over here the German Shepherd dog is the CHEAPEST breed, and at the same time it´s the breed with the HIGHEST requirements prior to breeding.
I already said this, and a lot of people outside of Europe don´t understand, but training and breeding working dogs is a lifestyle, it´s no money machine.
But even over here times change...