working dog prices?? - Page 3

Alabama- I didn't realize yorkies would go for that kind of money either. lol  Funny that so many people will pay that much for a little dog that weighs less than the bag of dog food I buy for 1 of my gsd's. lol 

As for the Gsd's many folks who haven't been schooled have this preconception that you do get better puppies or dogs in Europe.  I don't necessarily agree with that BUT I can say that if you do not know who to deal with here in the US you will pay more for the same dog as you would if you got it imported.  My research showed that to be pretty consistant when I spent several months looking for a specific dog.  I had a guy once say to me "why you no buy from me- why you go buy from xyz?"  I could tell the guy was a bit on the arrogant side so I asked him how much he would have sold me my Agar?  He said "oh probably about $7,000 plus the shipping.  I laughed and said playfully "THAT'S why I no buy from you!" lol

I don't expect to get the deal of the century on a quality dog and I have to problem paying the fair going rate for a quality dog that is exactly what I want BUT I do have a problem with someone trying to over charge and make a killing.  I think this happens often here in the US so people get disgusted and start looking to the Europeans. JMO

Chris

I think you hit the nail on the head when you mentioned geography.  I don't know if the US has as good of dogs as Germany, but the country is so large and the good studs are so spread out all over the country, it makes it a bit harder to have the production that you have in Germany.  Like you said, you could drive to another country in 2 hrs.  Can you imagine if the US was the size of Wisconsin and that is as far as you had to go to find a suitable stud?  I think that geography plays one of the biggest roles in the US breeding program.  People often "settle" for a stud closer to them instead of going a bit farther for more of an appropriate match.

People have the money, they think more money equals better, they do little research and do not  talk to those that know. For $2500 I will go to W. Germ. or Czech Rep. and bring one back that has a far better track record or deal from here with a reputable breeder such as Kirschental (sp )  and still pay less.  I am not going to bad mouth any breeder,I will just say buyer beware.

Okay guys and gals    Somehow I stumbled on this website a 4 am this morning     it appeared on my browser...

This kennel is west of Me about and 1 hour away... here in Texas..    

http://www.ottogsd.com/about_us.htm     Her pups start at $ 2,500.00 ....   what do you think?

otto shepherds?? ONE titled female and she wants 2,500.00 for a puppy?

 not from me

It's also much easier to train and title a dog in Germany.  Clubs are abundant with knowledgable trainers and here we have Timothy Helser's.  A two hour drive to train your dogs is common in the U.S. and trials are few and far between.

American's are breeding some nice dogs but it's costlier to title and to breed therefore breeders are charging more for their pups.  Unfortunately we also have the breeders that think that since everyone else is getting that kind of money, they can breed their untitled, un-OFA'd dogs and ask the same kind of money.  I'd rather hand over my money to an American that is working their own dogs than to a Kraftwerk who is importing and breeding the best.

Mine are as good as anyone's and I usually get $1200-1800., avg. $1500. for my working pups. Local market area and clever  marketing has a lot to do with it I think. Out here in the sticks I'm lucky to get $1200. for a pup that would bring $1800. on the West coast or nearer to a major population center.  The good news is that we don't have a $2500.+/mo. house payment like we would closer to civilization, ridiculous overhead as far as permits, property taxes, etc., although the other cost-of-living expenses are just as high or higher here as most places. 

After a visit to friends in CA last fall, when my husband and I visited a couple of my long-time working GSD friends (who shall remain nameless...) to find they had a house full of party-colored Pom's they can sell for $2500. and up, I'm really re-thinking the GSD breeding thing. Ha ha ha.

Hell, those damned things are so small you could house a whole slew of 'em in the garage if you could stand the yapping! WHAT marketting? Alll they do is put a classified ad in the paper and the little bark machines disappear into the living rooms of obscurity, on spay and neuter contracts, like bats out of a cave on a summer night.

Hmmmmm

SS

Shelly are those your initials or dollar signs at the bottom left corner of your post?

OH, and I love your statement, "Mine are as good as anyone's and I usually get......."----------But are they real?

i'll preface my views on pup prices by saying that i consider my self a novice and hobby trainer/handler.i'll have to agree that pup prices tend to get outrageous(working or show).seems that the more"well versed" we get on the bloodlines,the more we'll pay,hoping to get that"SUPER PUP" that will propel us to the level beyond"novice"! thanks to excellent resources like this website...the info is easily at hand.it may be that people in EUROPE don't have to pay the prices we pay for a "quality prospect"(and that's all any pup is)i'll asume that the EUROPEANS are able to get good to excellent pups at much lower prices simply because of proximity and less "one upmanship"at the club level.or consider the top trainers in the U.S.A.,who may be able to be given top prospects to condition and train...then be sold for top dollar as a serious schutzhund contender!there are some very good breedings right here in the good ol' USA,and a "savy,old school" trainer/handler/breeder will know how,when and where to get these dogs for prices much less than what the average enthuastist will pay....consider how many"well bred young rotties" are cast off because after paying big bucks,a hard charging "newbie" handler/trainer just got impatient,couldn't wait on the maturity to develop...that's when "MR.OLD SCHOOL" steps in and gets that rottie for next to nothing,retrains him and BAM.....schutzhund prospect(seen it happen more than once)...so,what would i pay for a pup(if i needed one)...i'd be hard pressed to go beyond a grand for a pup...and since competion isn't important to me in any shape,form or fashion...i could get a "suitable pup" for less than 600.00,what i'm willing to pay won't "crash the market",but i do think it's getting out of hand!

Ostsee,

with all due respect, but statements like yours (I could get a "suitable pup" for less than $ 600.00) make the BYB business thrive. A serious breeder who takes his females to suitable studs in Germany, or even here in the U.S. could never afford to sell these puppies for $ 600.00 . It is a simple matter of mathematics: If 5 puppies (average) are sold for $ 600, that produces an income of $ 3,000. A plane ticket to Europe averages $ 1,500 plus the charge for the dog, which is (roundtrip) another $ 600  (if you are lucky). Next, you will have to have a rental car and a hotel room (for about a week, otherwise your airfare goes up significantly). Gas prices are quite high in Europe as well. By the time you get back, all your puppy income is spent just on travel expenses. You still need to pay veterinarians and the stud fee. What about your time? Do you get paid leave? Do you have other dogs at home which need to be boarded (boarding fees here in Washington D.C. are about $ 30 a day, if you get lucky)? And heaven forbid that you run into problems with the female or the puppies: We had to pay for a C-section a while ago. While our vet gives us discounts, it was still about $1,000. And I never forget my first B-litter in 1994: We bred to VA-1 Fanto vom Hirschel and had 8 beautiful puppies. Except for one, they all died at 8 weeks of age of Parvo. My vet and his tech had to come to our house and try to save them with IV fluids and other supportive care. Besides our emotional distress, our financial burden was devastating. We lost thousands of dollars and the only surviving female was undersized due to malnutrition and placed into a loving pet home (she died of old age). This is an extreme example of a breeder's calculation taking a dreadfully wrong turn. There are plenty of other examples. People just hear the so called outrageous prices and have no clue. If you have not walked into anybody's shoes, don't judge them. I am sorry about this vent, but these kind of opinions irritate the crap out of me. And please, do not reply now that you are not looking into "serious competition". I have said it before and mention it again: The so-called newbies and "other" breeders keep riding on the accomplishments of a dog's pedigree but will scream the loudest about temperament and workability. These attributes are only preserved by titling and breed surveying these dogs. And this costs money for which a breeder has a right to be compensated. You think that puppy prices in Germany are cheap? Nope, not in comparison to cost. You will pay anywhere from 500 to 1,000 Euros for a puppy with no written guarantees. This amounts to 700 to 1,400 US-Dollars with the current exchange rate. Earlier, people got uptight about Kraftwerk selling puppies for $ 2,500 but in another thread, people think nothing of paying $3,000 for a coveted Tiekerhook puppy. .....

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