Dogs that spin vs. Dogs that don't - Page 2

I  also think spinning is a nerve issue and while you can work on stopping the spinning you can't fix the nerve issue.

Well I will take a dissenting opinion on this one.

I do not believe spinning in neccesarily a nerve issue. My little dog spins but she spins when the decoy backs off. When the decoy is up and in front of her the dog does not spin. What does that mean? I wouldn't call that a nerve issue. If it was a nerve issue I would think the dog would spin under the pressure. I think it is genetic and part of the dogs make-up. It is also a GSD thing. I do not see other breeds doing it. Hardly ever. If the dog is spinning when the decoy is up close and personal, that is a different issue and could be a nerve problem.

I do agree that this can be the problem of a dog having so much drive they don't know what to do with it. Is that a bad thing?

Obviously you can't have a dog spinning around during a Sch bark and hold so for that venue it must be fixed. If you are doing things other than Sch what does it matter? If you are doing anothre sport or police service do you think the dog is going to stop going down the field and start spinning? Is the dog going to come off the bite and start spinning around the bad guy? I highly doub't it and have never seen it.

I don't like it because it can make foundation work on a young dog more difficult for the decoy, but I don't fight it if they do it.  Now if they start spining around acting stupid and not paying attention to the decoy I will sting them in the ass to let them know they better pay attention.

My two cents.

I've never seen a "spinner" come off the sleeve or fail to engage either, they spin and can't focus during the guarding.  Still a problem with the temperament/nerves IMO, and very difficult to fix.

This is known as canine complusive disorders usually induced by stress. Do a web search and you can read alot of articles on the subject.

Well  think we may be talking apples and oranges. You are talking about a dog that is spining in the guard or the bark and hold. I stated a dog spinning up close and personal may be a nerve issue.

What about the dog who spins out of control when agitated from a distance but comes straight forward into the decoy as they get close? How is that a nerve issue? I am not trying to be argumentative, just looking for your opinion,  which I value and the opinion of others.

I also would like to hear about other breeds. I have worked alot of breeds; mals, dutchies, GSD, Crosses thereof, and bull breeeds like American bulldgs, presas, and carne corso's. Not one dog other than a GSD sticks in my mind as having seen or worked that demostrated excessive spinning.

What's up with that? Maybe I have just seen all outstanding examples of these various breeds that have far better nerve than GSD, but I don't think so.

I have seen spinners who only spin when the helper is close, and others who spin anytime they get "amped" - helper close, far away - or no helper at all - another dog playing ball for instance - and some do it in their crates when there is anything stimulating them at all, others are quiet in the crate.  I think ALL spinning, no matter what stimulates it - is indicative of a nerve issue that may or may not have anything to do with the temperament of the dog otherwise - dog isn't necessarily a "nervebag" - just can't handle the high drive level, nerves are not strong enough and the dog is not clear in the head, can't focus when in drive.  I personally hate dogs like that and wouldn't want to deal with one as trainer or handler.

I haven't had a whole lot of experience with other breeds, but the Rotts, Presas, Cane Corsos, Am Bulldogs and Boerboels that I have known, don't have the drive-level that the GSD is capable of.  They simply don't get "that amped up" in my experience.  Nerve issues are shown in different ways with those lower-drive breeds.  I have seen spinning problems in Malinios, Border Collies, Terriers and other high-drive breeds (not only doing bitework of course).

molly

gsdlver - so your dog is calm, confident, clear and focused while he is spinning sometimes?  I can't imagine how a dog could be spinning and also be calm, clear and focused.  It is a nerve issue, your dog has it if he spins, but maybe it's not so extreme as other dogs - still it is there and you see it when he spins.

http://www.btneuro.org/moon-fanelli_tufts_expo.htm

Here is one interesting article. From doing alittle research it seems this is a question that still has no one clear answer.

I still think it is a disorder brought on by stress which effects different dogs in different ways. Some show the disorder by

barking, tail chasing, spinning, licking, aggression etc....