Breed Improvement Suggestions for the UK GSD Breed Council - Page 47

Dont know if anyone heard tonight's Radio 4 but the KC are now making a complaint to OFTEL about the programme.

I think the suggestion to snail mail the suggestions to the RSPCA and Dogs Trust is a good one, also it might be worth sending them to "working" organisations such as Guide Dogs and the Police breeding centres as well.  The Guidedogs are about the only people who eye test their GSD's and the Police are certainly responsible for producing quite large numbers of GSDs in their breeding programmes and providing working homes for those given up by the pet owner who feels they have "bitten off more than they can chew" with our quick minded and very able bodied breed.

Not back from Germany yet but just come online to collect my emails and looked in here to answer any PM's and see how this thread had developed.

As a variety of proposals have apparently being sent to the Breed Council, wouldnt it be better to wait until we know which ones the Breed Council are going to adopt and put forward to the KC to use as the basic criteria for a Two Tier Registration system before haphazardly sending lists of currently unadopted proposals?

Seems foolish to provide the RSPA, Dogs Trust or any other group who were prepared to issue the type of 'one sided', negative reporting, such as was shown on this programme with any more amunition that they could throw back at us should some proposals not come to fruition. I'm all for attempting to make friends of ones enemies but not if it entails the possibility of shooting oneself or ones alies in the foot in order to do so.

Regards

Sue B

Sue B, when are we likely to know what the BC intends to adopt?

I would never contact the RSPCA about anything to do with animal welfare... they are strictly a business, have been for many years now.  The icing on the cake for me was their total support of the DDA.  If it gets them publicity on TV... that's what interests them... try getting HOLD of them when you need help with an injured bird, fox etc; if you succeed you're told to take it to your local Vet, as they have an obligation to look after wildlife!  I'll put my soapbox away now!

Not sure what Mr Payne is suggesting re his plagerism remarks. Contrary to his belief he is not the only person in this breed with original thoughts and ideas. As for not knowing of any other proposals,  didnt know they all had to be run past him first? Therefore just because he does not know of any doesnt mean they dont exist, a few were sent to the BC Sec and PM,d to others here before any appeared on the Videx website, but heavens forbid anyone else would be so fickle as to suggest plagerism there, what matters is the breed,  not who suggested what, where or when and if I remember rightly the suggestion of a Two Tier Reg System originally came from Reason but I dont hear him/her complaining about others adopting his/her idea as the basis for their proposals! 

Get fed up of coming on here to nasty inuendo's, plagerism indeed, how pathetic!!

Regards

Sue B

THIS NOTE ADDED VIA EDIT FACILITY on Mon 22nd Sept 11.26hrs uk time. Since Videx appears to have removed his plagerism post it now leaves the above out of context. I am pleased after an obvious rethink Videx saw fit to remove his accusation and I for one (along with others I am sure), will take as an apology. I gave some consideration to removing my post but as I only have the facility to remove the wording and not the entire entry, I decided against it as to do so would also make one of Reason's post out of context and I don't think that would be right or fair. 

Hi Misbeeb

Totally agree with you re the RSPCA !  As for what the BC are likely to adopt , would love to say in the next few weeks but more likely not to be until after the next BC meeting of Clubs which I think is in Nov but Sheila will know that best as I still away in Germany.

Regards

Sue

I have been busy training last few days trials are coming thick and fast and i need to do some tidying in the training

First it was me that proposed the idea of a two teir system,which videx very kindly put into a more detailed and presentable form on the health issues, i am working on a programme to instigate the working parameter on a increasing basis to lead to a Koreung, this will have to be introduced gradually as the reality suggests that the majority of the breed enthusiasts do not really want to do it.

Videx I quite agree that a continental koreung could be arranged in a matter of months and nothing i would wish for more but the reality is that the working dogs would not have all the health confirmationed and the breed dogs could not be trained in a few months to do the working aspect so the entry would be almost nil

When i have pondered further of the intro of working into the Breed Survey i will post the bones of it and would invite someone with better english skills than me to put it into a more presentable form.

Reason, I agree we need to start with very basic stuff and work upwards.

Speaking with some other GSD folk and asking their opinions on the suggested two tier reg system as put forward by Videx, the following comments were made.

Re hip score, the total of 25 seems a little high in somes opinion.  My thoughts here are that this is above the breed average ( didnt it used to be 17) so if that is the case then the total needs to be lowered.

Also an interesting comment re colour which I could not answer, perhaps it could be considered here.  If Class one parents produce coat colour and type other than standard ie white, liver,blue, long etc would those puppies be registered as Class 1 produce.

Another question that is of concern is that would the system ultimately lead to a very restricted gene pool.  If this was the case would we not end up in a situation similar to the 50s and 60s where a well known dog was used extensively to the detriment of the breed.

Just thoughts

Avril

maybe i am just too cynical, but could it be that there are more non standard colours popping up in litters, and that is why  it has now been suggested that non standard colours should not be excluded from achieving a Class One. If thats the case, I am off to buy a mongrel.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Avril,

Re:  colours a perfect situation can not be put forward there are too many things to consider and this thread was about health. Surely if the colour of the puppy is outside of the breed standard it should not be registered.  The trouble is no matter how we try we will not be able to alter the ethics of some of the breeders we can only hope they will be honest.

You suggest that this proposal will ultimately lead to a reduction of the gene pool.  Your earlier concern was for the health of the GSD and if weeding out those that are producing this unhealthy state redces the available gene pool I'm sure with clever breeding we could over come this.  Probably breeders would have to look at alternative lines there are some out there.  It may mean that the GSD as a show dog would not be at it's best for a few generations. Alternatively this suggestion was about a two teir sytem so those that didn't want to comply fully could still be involved and register their stock.

I'm looking forward to seeing what propsal Reason can put forward regarding  a slow integration towards a full koreung.  Has I have probably only got one dog left in me I wont have a dog that has a koreung but you never know  I may manage it, I like to think I could.

Jess