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by olskoolgsds on 15 August 2009 - 04:08
Way too much to read here, but did read some of Maggie, Slam, Steve and KC.
It is so easy to make judgements about what abuse is. These questions have come on here before, with basically the same outcome, no minds are changed. Those that can only see through their own eyes and refuse to understand that there may be dogs of different temperaments, handler aggressive, etc. as opposed to a handler pleasing dog. Years ago I have had to string up a few dogs. It was that or end the dogs life. If the dog had some value to serve, and enjoyed working, then it was worth it to me. My rule was that it was for what I called "cardinal sins". These included aggression towards children, or EXCESSIVE aggresion towards others without good reason, or anything that would ultimately lead to the dog loosing his life by being put down or killed as a result of his actions. It was something you did when you knew nothing else was going to change this dogs determination to fight an unprovoked fight. This was not neseccarily a last means effort either. I did not believe in running a dog through alot of disciplines or other possitive methods when I knew this dog had a mind of his own and he was going to do some serious damage to the wrong people. These dogs take a correction very well, in fact too well.
This is not something I would do today, (physically can't) and there are too many people waiting to call on the mounties. These are not dogs you have raised, they are usually dogs that someone has given up on and this is their last chance to become something useful to serve man. I do not want to say that this is the best method, or the only method that will work, it is just something that happens when it happens and it is all you have to work with and something needs to be done now. Personally, I think abuse is allowing a dog to get away with something serious, then taking them to the vet to be put down. Many think prong collars or and e collars are abusive. One thing is for sure, some will see anything as abusive, some will see some methods as abusive and others will see nothing as abusive if it saves the dogs life in the end. Stringing a dog up is a relatively short term, severe (gets their attention) and has some degree of success if you call saving the dog from lethal ingection successful.
by olskoolgsds on 15 August 2009 - 05:08
Example: A friend of mine was traveling to work on the freeway. A large Buck ran out in front of his car. Instantly the Bucks antlers were going through his windshield. This Buck literally totaled his car. I saw the pictures of it and it is amazing that my friend did not die from these antlers. He stopped his car off the road and walked to an emergency phone. ( not all had cell phones at this time). He called the state patrol and told them what happened. The officer that showed up was a young lady that appeared to be emotionally upset by the Bucks death. She showed no concern for the mans safety or his vehicle. She angrily handed him what appeared to be a ticket. After getting home he discovered that he had been given a ticket for animal abuse.
He took it to court, asked the jude if she thought that he would deliberately hit an animal of that size, destroy his car (his insurance did not cover the damage) and then go and call the state patrol? The judge, thank goodness, had a degree of common sense and threw it out. She also admonished the trooper and told her she wanted to see her in her chambers.
Moral of the story, PERCEPTIONS. She had her perceptions of what happened and was willing to penalize someone for what she perceived was a crime. I am sure if you heard her tell her friends what happened, they would all be on her side.
Everyone has their own way of looking at something, it doesnt make it accurate. As a rule, I take what I see or read on the internet with a huge grain or salt. Especially when they appear to have an axe to grind. In this day and age of the internet, it is very wise not to be naive. Sorry for the long post.
by wuzzup on 15 August 2009 - 05:08
i hope iy works
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZm037jPNgc
by Sunsilver on 15 August 2009 - 13:08
However, as those involved in shelters and rescues will tell you, there is no level to which the human being will not stoop when it comes to animal abuse.
Stringing a dog up, I can understand. I've done it myself when a dog tried to run after a bicycle, and wouldn't quit when other methods failed. She got the message pretty quickly (even though her back legs were still touching the ground.) I even heard of gentle 'walkies!' Barbara Woodhouse holding really bad actors suspended by their collars until they stopped trying to attack her.
But helicoptering?? For God's sake, what purpose does THAT serve, other than to kill or injure a dog? And, when one thinks about it logically, who, except maybe the Incredible Hulk, would have the strength to helicopter a GSD??
by Steve Leigh on 15 August 2009 - 20:08
by michael49 on 15 August 2009 - 22:08
I'll try to answer your question one last time.Police,schutzhund,personal protection,competition obedience,agility,herding,or any other venue of dog training,this happens.You got answers to your questions,some people have,some never have,some still do,some aren't willing to say.I personally have never been in a situation where I had to hang the dog,and I hope I never am.However if I had a dog that challenged me,and I was faced with hanging the dog to keep him from attacking me and possibly killing me,yes I would hang the dog,as a last resort.I would defend myself in any way possible.Some dogs will challenge you at some point,your options are do something that will stick with the dog forever and teach him to never do it again,second option kill the dog.Maybe you would just kill the dog,but I think I would choose the other option and may be end up with a good dog that I could get along with.Does it work the first time ,or do you have to do it again and again,I don't know never been in that sitiuation.I'm told if done properly that once is enough,what does it do to the dogs brain,again I don't know but if what I am told is correct,it makes him smart enough to never put himself in that position again.I personally would only harm the dog if his intension was to harm me.As for as letting someone join a club that does this for any other reason then stated,I would't want to train with that person,if you can even call that training.So for my part thats the best answer that I can give you.As for as the progression of dog training from the old school way [compulsion] to the new age [motivational] I doubt you'd get very far with a clicker,ball,or food when this dog comes up the leash.Is this a commonly used training method,not in any venue of dog training that I have ever witnessed.That being said,ther are all kinds of people in this world who knows what they will do or why.Dog training if done right developes a bond between dog and handler thats all about love and respect,not hate and contempt.So in closing,I ask that you don't put us all in the same box. Michael
by MaggieMae on 15 August 2009 - 23:08
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by George the Retard on 16 August 2009 - 00:08
hanging i have never done but i did have a dog who challenged me, if i had to protect myself i would do what it took and so would you. what happens when this mouthy one stands up to you hope you are ready. its called fight or flight.
have a great day
GTR
by George the Retard on 16 August 2009 - 00:08
hanging i have never done but i did have a dog who challenged me, if i had to protect myself i would do what it took and so would you. what happens when this mouthy one stands up to you hope you are ready. its called fight or flight.
have a great day
GTR
by michael49 on 16 August 2009 - 00:08
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