Middle of the road dog? See what u think? - Page 4

Thanks Lenny that is so true about a lot of pics on this site Ivory: go back to Ary vom Kleinen Taller thats where I started on my pedigree this am and when I saw the Am Ch on Klamme i just had to throw this open for discussion so I can learn about my dogs inheritance Look now at the difference in Ary which clicks right on back to Klamme. Donna Sur Steinbock burg is where i was on the bottom side Donna ws the granddam of Konig my first male gsd and I am now breeding the grand kids. I want all the people like Lenny to fill me in I want to know more Larry Filo and Rick Ford only told me so much because they were not the breeders I want to know anything u can lend ato this education I see the change from the 60-70 and like Lenny said some of the pics are bad

i LIKE aSSLAN EVEN IN THAT PIC U HAVE TO KNOW HE HAD MORE SUBSTANCE AFTER HE MATURED

Hey yellowrose of Texas, Several AKC show champions with Schutzhund titles are listed in the thread: Any AKC Breed Champions with SchH Titles? http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/21116.html#21659 There is many more mentioned from time to time here. I was the one who did the pedigree update on V Aßlan vom Klämmle and put the AM CH, prefix on V Aßlan vom Klämmle SchH3 Kkl1. I too was originally shocked when my AKC pedigrees had him as an AKC show champion when he is the sire to Kirschental dogs. The BSZS Sieger VA1 Eiko vom Kirschental SchH3 FH Kkl1, has AM CH, V Aßlan vom Klämmle SchH3 Kkl1 as a great grandfather. So German dogs can get AKC show titles, it can be done and has been done. Brian DeBow

nice looking dog, good grips, nice pedigree. looks like a dandy to me. pj powers

Hey DesertRangers, VA Quartz dei Templari SchH3 Kkl1 and VA Laius vom Moorbeck SCHH3, IPO3, FH2 Kkl1 are VA dogs, showline dogs that competed in the WUSV. I wouldn't call either of these dogs, middle of the road. As for the "golden middle" these dogs, high quality in both arenas. (show and working) Look at these dogs and see what you think? Brian DeBow

right Brian I had not looked at my german pedigrees in many years because I had no one to talk to about them and just got a computor this year tHis is all new to me and I love the database. I was looking at Ary vom Kleinen and Blue=Iris when I noticed the am ch and almost fainted these pedigrees are on my website and I havent had much time to study them or to talk to anyone about what is in my dogs. I have taken the pedigrees to work in the clubs but most of the clubs ive been in dont know anything about my pedigrees Im thrilled to be able to have someone able to tell me about any of the breed and i have a passel of them. I love the database but I can't read german so unless I have a pedigree that someone has interpreted I dont know a thing ...I know there are plenty of books to read but this is more fun doing this and getting input by german people or breeders that know these lines and the history I know some but not enought to talk the talk so fill me in,,,,,,

Brian, 1st let me say thanks for the email... Secondly I'll state here what I replied to you, I don't call the "golden middles" medocre dogs, in my mind "golden middle" = Dog that excells or has capacity to excell in sport and confirmation. "golden middle" = Sound Temperament, Sound Structure, Confidence, Drive, Grace, Beauty, Superior Health ie. no health issues, ALL around SUPERIOR DOG !! That is "my" defenition of "golden middle" others may define it differently but that's mine. :-) Apparently our dogs have alot of SV show lines in them, But also have some working lines there too. What I do know is that we LOVE them for all they're qualities and will continue with them and continue to develop/improve upon every aspect possible, one thing I have noticed is that our dogs are well within the standards including the MEDIUM Size prefference, No roach backs, overangulation, and certainly no Temperament issues, never had a bloat, or digestive issue of any kind, all hips so far OFA at Good, All ears are up no taping required(as of yet), no washouts or faded colors, Absolutely Superior Temperaments to die for, and Just all around really nice dogs. I think we have a super start on a super line here and plan to go on with it and see what we can do, I have kept some females back and two males so far. I look for outside dogs to breed to or females to bring in that posess the traits my dogs have and could better them, and will continue to do that as well, weather they be show/working LINES I dont' much care, If I like the dog, (say it's a male) and I think he can bring a little extra something in, I'm gonna go with him, I will NOT ever get into this "you can't MIX show/working lines" to me that's just spewing BS. Not saying you are saying it, Others have, and I don't buy it. :-)

I think this thread has gotten a little too mixed together. And I'm one of the ones to blame. The original question fro DesertRanger was concerning Andy Snezna Rieka. Then Yellowrose asked about Am.Ch.V Ablan vom Klammle and I responded to her with a published description of his Sire. I think we are now mixing the discussions. My concern is this: Ref Am.Ch.V Ablan vom Klammle. His sire is known to produce bad temperament. "Lenny" describes this dog as "His work was mediocre and he was a horrific character producer. In most cases all the puppies had less character than the mother." Yet, most of the remarks about him have been positive. Not to step on anyone's toes, I really don't want to start an argument over this, but my personal opinion is that I don't care how good a dog looks, if he has questionable character and comes from such stock, I would reject the dog out of hand.

I think Andy's a great looking GSD with bone/color and nerves...he proves that. I think he's oversized for show and under "driven" for work.. so yes a happy medium he looks to me. I think the price is off the wall though for a puppy, I'm not a breeder so I must be wrong. :o( He is the size GSD I'm looking for in a female ... but, not that price for a puppy. Darn it.

But onguy : dont be sorry/ we can all follow the threads ok i cn tell whose talking about who...I just wanted to show that my old pedigree walked down the middle u could say and mixed at that point in time with both types. I cant reject the breeding because its in my old pedigree of by first two and I have never had bad character or traits such as you spoke of. maybe it got corrected that what we are suppose to do correct what we can. I just looked at Bullingers ad and Tracy addresses the "golden Middle" in her ad Usa Dogs 2006 annual pg 328......