Are Titles Necessary Before Breeding? - Page 17

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by spook101 on 18 January 2007 - 18:01

Again Echo, you need to offer the post I was responding to, but fail to post it. It appears that you are lying by omission. A lie, is a lie, is a lie. Mel, she almost had me until she admitted that she could not discontinue her present practices because she needed the money. All this time she was declaring how it was all about the breed.

by shinokami on 18 January 2007 - 19:01

While I agree that you should still continue to learn while breeding, it's ridiculous to expect to learn the basics from breeding alone. At the very least, to start breeding, one should have a good idea about bloodlines and what one is aiming to produce, and circulate breeding stock until the proper dogs are found. This is why I've realized I don't have what it takes to breed--because while I can be subjective about my own dogs' abilities and know for a fact what they are and what they aren't, I can't be subjective enough to get rid of them knowing they don't have what it takes to be bred. I see a lot of posts in this thread saying everybody has to start from somewhere, and I agree, but when you start, you have to know where you're going, otherwise it's just an excuse to churn out puppies. I have a friend who is just starting out breeding, and I admire him a lot because he knows what he wants and has spent time the past few years weeding through actually *good* dogs to find one he feels is good enough to be bred. And he's pretty young, only a few years older than me.

by Drakegsd on 18 January 2007 - 22:01

I have to say that I have been reading this topic for a while and I tried to keep my mouth shut, but here are just a few questions I have for you Echo... I understand that titles and breed survey is not what makes a dog but it sure is a tool in assessing the dog's contribution to the breed. I was looking at your website and I didnt see any show ratings mentioned on your dogs. Have they ever been shown? If so how did they do in the ring. You posted critiques on your dogs and I would like to know who gave those critiques. I am sorry but this quote from your website just strikes me as BS "Super expression. his croup appears shorter due to a higher tail set, which of course throws his overall appearance of balance off" And I have to say that the price of your "oops" litter really made me cringe. You want $750 dollars for "oops" puppies with limited registration... I am not sure if I should be suprised at the price or at the fact that people actually willing to pay that amount of money. I bought my dog less than 2 years ago for $1000. Full registration, titled parents and he is placing very high in the show ring (SG1 in youth class in NE Regional show as well as numerous top 3 placings in puppy and youth classes), he also is doing very well in SchH. So I have to say that the thought of asking $750 dollars for an accidental litter makes me very seriously doubt your motives... Ok I am ready for you to jump dowm my throat... so far you have only played nice with people who you think agree with you and been pretty nasty to everybody who challenged your breeding practices...

sueincc

by sueincc on 18 January 2007 - 22:01

I think another reason that titles are necessary is that is the SV system. When we ignore the SV, we end up with the American Shepherd.....nuff said?!?!?

sueincc

by sueincc on 18 January 2007 - 23:01

I just want to add that I think on our own we (United States) have had a tendancy in the past to breed really bad shepherds. I think we need to adhere to at least the minimum rules of the SV, in order to keep away from the American Show Shepherd type, & prove we can be responsible to the breed. I'm not saying everyone who does not title their dogs is producing a poor shepherd, but that has been our track record. I'm saying without rules & standards it is very easy to return to the American type. If anyone thinks I am over reacting, go take a look at rintintin.com - now what the heck kind of a breeding program is that?

by shinokami on 19 January 2007 - 00:01

Maybe a good analogy to in-between this discussion is what I always tell kid writers in our writing group--the rules are there for a reason. Afterwards, when you're more experienced, you can consider them 'guidelines', but after, not before. If you break a rule, you better damn well know why!

by EchoMeadows on 19 January 2007 - 02:01

Drake, Your post is Valid, why would I jump down your throat ? I am not the nasty villan spook and melody have made me out to be. I paid much more than 1000.00 for my first dogs, No show titles, No Sch titles, But very sound lines. and Extremely good Temperaments, Good hips in the backgrounds for several generations. I paid for Healthy dogs. My pricing is no ones concern, You Pay what you want for what you want from whom you want it from, Simple as that. I work in the shelter and have a realization that if you put no "value" on a dog, neighther do the people who end up with them, I actually had a guy tell me, "I got the dog free, why do I wanna pay 25.00 to get him out to the city ?" What a jerk he was, but there are many like him, one even went on to say Maybe if I'd paid like 300 bucks for the dog I would bail him out but no way man I got it for 50.00 you can have it. So cold !! So I priced these pups in my opinion accordingly. You may feel it's off and your welcome to feel that way. I don't hold feelings against people, But when they say pointing they're fingers at me, YOU Are blah blah blah,, and Your doing blah blah blah, is when I get a bit perterbed to say the least. If you wish to state facts you better know them, if you wish to offer your opinion, well offer it, as you are the only one who knows your opinion/feelings. make any sense ? I'm not being nasty, really asking if that makes sense to you. I hope you understand where I'm coming from with that anyway. Shinokami, I have not broken any rules if I am the one you are reffering to, I have not, Nor would I ever !! Shinokami, everyone did start from somewhere, some knew right off which direction they wanted to proceed, others got a feel for it, I am not NEW to GSD Breed, just new the Breeding. Does that help clarify ? I've done my homework 15+ years of getting to know the breed and bloodlines still learning and will forever be learning bloodlines, as new ones keep popping up, is that NOT wise of me to continue to learn?

by Cassidy Kay on 19 January 2007 - 03:01

I have yet to produce a litter and I don't even know at this point if that is an option to me at all. My dog is young and I want to take her as far as I can in training, Sch, SaR, Obed, ect. ect. But that is my choice and I don't think anybody on this site has the right to tell people what they can or cannot do with their dogs. Go to a school and preach about the importance of not breeding unregistered mixed breeds or breeding only for money and more money. No one on here has the right to tell somone that they are a byb when all they have to go off of is a web site. Come on!! I read posts on this site everyday and I have to say there is a very small group of people who's posts I read because the ignorance and stupidity that people talk is insane. Do something about back yard breeding, something other than coming on here and bitching about someone you know nothing about. Grow up!!! Be constructive and DO something about it.

by Melody_Gray on 19 January 2007 - 04:01

Echo, I never referred to you as a villan. You are a back yard breeder! Mel graymelody@gmail.com

by shinokami on 19 January 2007 - 05:01

"Shinokami, I have not broken any rules if I am the one you are reffering to, I have not, Nor would I ever !!" A bit defensive much? ;) I'm not referring to you. I am interested in the actual discussion of the topic at hand, not seeing anyone's reasons/excuses and so on.





 


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