When did either starving, beating or choking... - Page 1

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by roborob on 06 February 2007 - 13:02

Having had GSds my entire life which means nothing I suppose in the long run...I just have to ask when it became acceptable to starve, choke or beat a dog into "submission" for whatever reason...???Is this the new method of trainning what has been refered to as our beloved GSDs that we supposedly cherish almost as much as our families(and sometimes more)...???JMO but when you have to use violence with either your dog or your children I think you've already lost...???Please somebody correct me if I'm wrong about how some people are treating their dogs but thats not what or how I treated my boy and girls in the past and now that I'm looking to get a new pup; beating, choking or starvation were never options I thought to use in trainning her...I could be wrong here but I don't think so, I'm open to any and all suggestions on proper trainning techniques... I await what i expect to be many replies, some good, some bad and some ugly...Oh Ceasar... Rob

harley

by harley on 06 February 2007 - 14:02

hi rob, i agree, if it comes to that, to get "the respect" from the dog, there is something wrong.(with the dog) yes there are hard dogs that need to be put in there place, but to show them "now you are the new GOD in his eyes" and almost kill them so they see you as GOD is extreme. shame people actually still HANG there dogs until they "tap out"(wrestling move)

Kelly M Shaw

by Kelly M Shaw on 06 February 2007 - 14:02

roborob, I agree with you 100%. I actually new of a couple of people that did this. One was a rottie that I was trying to get it away from it's owner. The neighbor's were going to testify that he was hanging his dog up in the bag yard, she had rope burns around her hind legs, and the kicker of it was she was a very sweet dog.I don't mean to talk bad about someone that has passed away but, The other was a trainer for schutzhund and he would come to our club and put carpenter nails upside down on the jump, so when the girl would jump and would hit the jump, the nails would dig into her pads. She left with bloody paws. Again I apologize for talking bad about someone that has passed. I think you should train with praise and motivation, even when the dog is a little hard headed. JMO

by wscott00 on 06 February 2007 - 15:02

Rob.. its not the new method of training, rather the old one. IMO youve made a pretty board statement. I have starve, choked and hit my dog. if he doesnt want to track, fine by me...he wont eat. if he insist on pulling too hard while tracking or wont out, then ill take away his air. he tries to bite me, ill beat him. what you must understand is that if you are going to compete or train in any venue you will need to use pressure. having said that you must realize that pressurre can be any thing from .01 (a slight tug on a collar) to 10 (high e-collar). some one once told me that you must use pressure if you want to V any phase.... But just like your faucet at home. if there is not pressure, then no water comes out. if there is too much pressure pipes burst. the trick is usiong just enough pressure. w/ out pressure there can be not accountabilty, w/ out accountabilty there will be no reliability, and w/ out reliability there can be not consistancy. Im sure someone will say that you can train a dog in sch. 100% motivational. this is true but it will never compete on the highest level, time and time again So you might ask yourself who are you watching train this way, how long have they been training, and most importantly how successful are they. just my 2 cents

by Blitzen on 06 February 2007 - 15:02

Hanging dogs, helicoptoring them, can cause permanent damage to the dog's trachea. I expect any who speak up against cruel methods of training will be getting plenty of flack. We will be told we don't know what we're talking about and our concern for the welfare of the dog spun around and used to prove we are bleeding hearts who don't have a clue. Some are so proud of how tough their dogs are and how tough they are as trainers that they just have to brag about it. They even video it and put it on the net so anyone, including the AR people, can view them in action. Whatever happened to breeding for the correct temperament, the will to serve? Somehow I doubt that a dog needing to be choaked into submission or one that puts its handler into the hospital is what Herr Captain had in mind.

by jbrown on 06 February 2007 - 15:02

I dont know, i guess i could be wrong but i would thnk if you beat a dog for trying to bite you wouldnt that take away the trust in you and fear you to the point of wanting to bite you again. sorry but i think that would be more harm than good. I seen a guy beat his dog once when he tried to bite him well it turned out to be a battle on the field everytime i seen them train. everytime this guy walked up to the dog after he did something wrong the dog showed teeth. you can correct a dog without beating.......

by Blitzen on 06 February 2007 - 15:02

See what I mean?

Kelly M Shaw

by Kelly M Shaw on 06 February 2007 - 15:02

The male that I have I know he can go all the way and that is with out starving, beating, or choking him in order for him to succeed. I am going back to training this spring and this dog has so much drive and has a clear mind to go as far as I can take him. IMO I don't agree with beating or etc to get a dog to do what you expect them to do. JM2Cents

by jbrown on 06 February 2007 - 15:02

Blitzen, you are so right. i have a dog thats very head strong and i know if i ever BEAT him he would have my butt or try. I would never beat my dog ever. we just work around every problem the best we can and go into the show ring and kick major butt.

by Kenan on 06 February 2007 - 15:02

To make things clear I am against using above described methods during the training. However, there are dogs out there with whoom motivational training will not take you anywhere. Such dogs are few and far in between but they are there. Conventional methods of training just do not work with them and they need that extra hardness for the simple reason, they are HARD themselves. Of course when one is hard with his dog he must know exactly how far he can go. That is why such dogs are not for an "average trainer" to work with. I had couple of such dogs, I tried but they were too much for me to handle so they ended up with professionals. They are now excellent police dogs.





 


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