What would you do? - Page 5

Fwiw,

I've helped receive many military K9s and have had several otherwise sound dogs plastered to the inside of the crate on arrival, many that won't let you open the crate etc.... flight is not exactly something we have access to to gage a pups response, ya know.

I'm not worried about Eska's behavior coming out of the crate. If the pup I had received was playing after 2 min and never looked back, this thread would not be here. I'd be out playing with my puppy. Pup does not trust the person on the other end.... some flights are more traumatic than others. For all we know, her crate was dropped off a baggage cart. <shrug>. Again, the recovery is what is important to me.

We will see how she turns out. :)

Melba,

you got your money back, some people told you they would have waited, some supported your decision. At this point, you are only trying to do WHAT EXACTLY.. I am glad that the puppy went back, it did not stand a chance as you pretty much did not like it!? Well too bad, someone else will find her perfect!

Just like Sunsilver found your puppy perfect.. Somebody else would have been dissapointed with the reaction at the airport  like for example Jenni...

I have no idea what you are trying to accomplish at tis point.

Well maybe i should have not read the forum, has been a while..

Martina

Melissa, I apologize. I did not realize SS was talking about a dog you bred. I would not have said anything. The description and conclusion just seemed odd to me. Again, my apologies. 

Just chatting with Jenni and SS now Martina.

We all have different ideas of what we want to see right away.

Melissa

Not getting upset, Jenni. It's just your comment had me scratching my head as I didn't realize it was a joke.

Would I have preferred the pup walked out of the crate like she owned the world? Of course I would! 

She also didn't want to go back into the crate, either, so something must have happened during the flight to spook her.

But her behaviour since then has given no cause for concern. She sleeps in the crate at night, and gets in and out of the crate in my SUV with no issues.

As Melba says, we'll see how things go. So far, I'm pleased with what I see. And as you say, different strokes for different folks! I would not have wanted the pup to charge out of the crate and bite the first person it saw!   

For crying out loud, we're talking about individuals, both human and canine, and each are unique.  Over the course of the ten+ years I was involved in sled dogs, I worked with 100's of pups, since that was my role on the human side of the team--I harness broke the puppies, evaluated what positions they were most comfortable in, started them out for lead position... During that time, there were some pups who were great workers, had great speed and stamina, but for various reasons their personality and mine just weren't a match.  Neither of us was ever going to be able to fully appreciate the other--so I was unlikely to ever get the dog's full cooperation and best performance in harness, and the dog was unlikely to ever work with the joyous abandon we insisted our racing dogs performed with in harness.  With those pups, I'd get the basic harness-breaking completed, and I'd make sure the heads of the team knew that this dog & I weren't on the same wave-length...so once the pup understood the point of the harness and the gangline and the sled or cart, it was handed off to one of the other team members to work with, so he or she could really show what they had to offer.  Likewise, there were some pups that were so darn obnoxious in their adolescence that everyone else hated fooling with them--these were the pups that always had to try everything to see what response it elicited. I like that type...even though it means you're getting off the sled or the rig every hundred yards or so to untangle to pup from the main line, or reconnect the neckline to their collar, or switching them back to the right side of the main line, or taking a tree branch out of their mouth that they grabbed as we turned a corner. 

I don't see this pup that melba had as lacking confidence because she kept wanting to go back in the house when melba had her outside and was trying to interact with her; from melba's own description, the pup simply wasn't interested in melba, and would rather go back inside where there was stuff that DID interest the puppy. Would the pup's connection with melba have developed with more time? Perhaps, but that doesn't mean she should have kept her longer; if melba prefers a pup that is more elastic with it's allegiences then that preference isn't going to change for any dog--and there's not a damn thing WRONG about that. Most people don't have the luxury of keeping a limitless number of dogs; people who have both their personal dogs AND who also train dogs for law enforcement might not be able to put in the above-and-beyond amount of work a seriously aloof and disdainful dog needs in order to be won over. 

Who knows--maybe the pup just didn't like being in North Carolina. Better that she go back to the breeder while still in her early behavioral development stages so the right person for the pup gets to experience those weeks with her.  Those are something one can never get back if you miss them, and there's been more than a time or two when I've wished I could have gotten my hands on a rescue dog back in those days of their lives, when they learned something obnoxious like leaping on any sort of lawn or snow equipment and attempting to dismantle it while I'm trying to use the item [said specifically about a very busy, very barky little black and red bitch lying at my feet right now]. The dog's joy in an activity learned so young often makes any attempt to suppress the behavior insufficiently consequential to continuing in it... 

I'm confused or you are, Hexe. 

I was talking about SS's dog lacking confidence, having to be driven to a different area, a quieter area, before she could be coaxed out of the crate, and then she immediately started tugging. SS said "now that's confidence!" I see that as not confident, and then avoidant- playing tug to avoid the stressful environment as a lot of high drive/lesser nerved dogs do. All I said was that I would not see that as a positive as she did, and I would WATCH the dog for other signs of potential issues. SS took it kind of wrong. 

I was not talking about Melba's dog lacking confidence. Just to clear that up...............

No, I didn't mean you, Jenni--I think it was SS who opined she might have judged the pup melba GOT to be lacking in confidence because she insisted on going back to sit on the doorstep when melba took her out into the open yard and tried to engage the pup; I view that behavior as melba simply not having made a sufficient impression on the pup to warrant said pup's attention and engagement.

Also wasn't referring to Eska, but I did see where someone ELSE had mused that THEY wouldn't consider the pup SS got to be confident, since she didn't want to come out of the crate while still in the cargo building at the airport. Me, I'm not a big fan of dogs that don't have enough sense to suss out the lay of the land before they plunge over the side of the canal and drown, if you know what I mean. Given what we all know can and too often does happen in the process of a dog or pup being shipped by air, there's no telling what SS's pup witnessed or was subjected to en route.  Clearly, though, the pup was resilient enough to bounce back once she confirmed for herself that things were more pleasant at the next location.

Personally, I don't consider the behaviors of EITHER pup to reflect one lacking in confidence. Neither situation provides sufficient information about the pup's strengths or lack thereof, IMO.

I agree. I don't like dogs who are so lacking in any suspicion that they wouldn't recognize a threat if it hit them in the head. I do not need a dog to run out of a crate and bite someone. But if I had a dog who was that difficult to get out of a crate after a plane ride, so difficult that they had to be driven elsewhere, *I'd take note and pay attention* which is all I suggested SS do. It was blown out of proportion. 

I totally disagree about "Now THAT's confidence!" because in my experience, that is not above average confidence. I do agree with you that not enough info is there to judge on that alone, hence my comment that I'd make mental note. 

if a pup didnt want to come out of the crate i'd shut the door and send it right back. a dog should either want to come out and greet you or bite you. of course it's very clear everyone has a different definition of what confidence is......