Definition of pet vs. working - Page 3

i think i will go train my sport dog and pet him for good work.  after we accomplish our Walter Mitty grand dream of playing LE.

Is that really true of Oz ?   I don't think its got like that here.

why does the military '' play war games''? We could go just f@%&** up some country who deserves it to make it "real''

I have never noticed a lot of posts "looking down" on individual's "pets". Maybe you could point out the threads where this is prevalent.

Having and expressng ones opnion on the state of the breed, the way to move forward, s/l vs. w/l is not an attack on one's individual dog. Some here would prefer that these things not be discussed at all and talk be limited to what wonderful dogs are being produced by every organazation, country and breeder.

Fortunately, there are still a few who believe the GSD should at a minimum meet the requirements set out in the International standard before being considered breed worthy.

Breeding "pets" for the sole purpose of producing "pets" should always be challenged and I hope that doesn't change.

A few question for those of you who consider your GSD's to be real working dogs:

1. If  you don't title them or place most of them with owners who do title them how did you arrive at that conclusion? In other words where's the proof that backs up the claims?

2. If you don't use them daily in your work or place most of them with owners who do, how do you know they are real working dogs and not pets that you only think are working dogs?

3. Do you base the conclusion on pedigrees only?

4.Do you think that service dogs are not real GSD's and why?

Why is argumentative posts about working dog breeders OK, but posts concerning show dog breeders is taboo. Just asking.

The post on 'breeding FOR pets should continue to be challenged' applies to any breeding yard.
To answer you, sort of...generally it appears the label WL is used to indicated color and structure other than b/r dogs. Maybe for clarification WL dogs should be refered to as: ACOB/R

ILMD, I agree.
Most people don´t "look down" on pets, why should they? It´s about breeding pets naming the offspring working dogs.

The definition of pet/working isn´t that easy to answer-

1. There are pet breeds and there are working dog breeds - in our case (GSD ) we are talking about a working dog breed.
2. There are working dog breeds and there are working dogs.
    A working dog doesn´t need to be out of a working dog breed, might even be a mutt.
3. The standard ( in my case SV ) describes the required temperament and work ethics of the German Shepherd dog.
4. According to the breed standard neither every working dog is breedworthy, nor is every dog with fancy pedigrees.

That said a German Shepherd dog is a working dog breed, there are working German Shepherds out there, and prior to breeding they need to proof their working abilities.

I thought quite some time about the definition of "working" in connection to a working dog breed.
First of all a hound dog needs different instincts than a German Shepherd dog.
A German Shepherd dog has to proof its breed worthiness ( IPO, RH2, herding, DH, + show rating, breed survey, health tests ).

IPO, formerly SchH, was introduced, because a lot of people wanted to own this special breed, but not all of these dogs are breedworthy, and you need to know which dog is and which dog isn´t. IPO is about tracking, obedience, bitework - the classic way, all of it, not just obedience, not just tracking, and not just bitework. It´s not perfect according to "working dogs", but it´s a lot better than nothing.

Today, with far better training methods, dogs bred for special traits, and better equipment, you are able to gain a IPO title with prey driven dogs only. You are able to cover a lot of faults, it is what it is.
So it´s more important than ever to watch the dogs during training and not to believe in titles "only". Does the dog in question really show the desired working abilities or not?

What is a working dog? A ( working ) hound, Retriever, Dachshund, scent detection dog, herding dog, protection dog, ... and on and on. Different temperaments, different goals, but "working".

 

What does a GSD need to do to be legitmately considered a real working dog and breed worthy?

Per Susie: A German Shepherd dog has to proof its breed worthiness ( IPO, RH2, herding, DH, + show rating, breed survey, health tests ).

So now I need to ask...since when do titles prove sperm count or motility? Titles, ANY titles, are reflective of the owner's effort and pocket. There are thousands of titled dogs all over this planet that are not worth the feed they eat, never mind their ability to produce.

By all means, test your dogs, put pressure on them, expose their nerves to all types of stimuli, but, when you are training with the end goal of a title, well...the game changes completely.

HD you are correct here; There are thousands of titled dogs all over this planet that are not worth the feed they eat, never mind their ability to produce.
By all means, test your dogs, put pressure on them, expose their nerves to all types of stimuli, but, when you are training with the end goal of a title, well...the game changes completely.

I owned a WUSV competitor that was afraid of a bunch of hogs...but guarantee you he didn't need to prove his steadiness around hogs to achieve Wusv qualification. Lol. A sch club training director yelled at me that THERE are NO Trials at FARM stores, THATS why he never takes any dog to any STORES !
That says a lot, IMO.