What will an IPO/Schutzund dog if the Sleeve is taken out of the picture? - Page 8

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BlackMalinois

by BlackMalinois on 10 August 2015 - 06:08

Of course there will be sport dogs who will  bite for real.


Its  more about genetiic and the dog have to stay in the fight under high pressure and pain in  all circumstances.



You need very good decoys who can do this in prey and defense scenarios testing dogs very
serious this decoys are hard to find. Many dogs will fail with this kind of serious decoys .  For real life

you can,t  also train every scenario.

99 percent of the youtube videos police/ sport is prey with less pressure because many decoys today
don,t know how to test dogs serious anymore.,  I like to test dogs hard and serious(and fair) but not only in trained

scenarios  also like to suprise the dog how his genetics are.

 

 

 

 

 


by gsdstudent on 10 August 2015 - 11:08

if we beat a dead horse with a padded stick will the outcome be any different?

by joanro on 10 August 2015 - 12:08

Blackmalinois, you nailed it.

Sunsilver

by Sunsilver on 10 August 2015 - 12:08

A couple who trains at our club has a German showline GSD. The other night, they were getting kind of silly, and the husband, who sometimes acts as a helper for the club, whacked his belt on the sofa, pretending he was going to attack his wife. He won't be doing that again anytime soon! The dog nearly ate him!  Teeth Smile


by joanro on 10 August 2015 - 12:08

'...... whacked his belt on the sofa, pretending he was going to attack his wife. He won't be doing that again anytime soon! The dog nearly ate him! ' and next thing she knows, hubby will tell her, 'the dog ran away.'

BlackMalinois

by BlackMalinois on 10 August 2015 - 19:08


Thanks Joan....


by Haz on 11 August 2015 - 01:08

I like Balabanov's training for PP, he takes sport dogs and does the conversion. He has some nice vids up. I truly believe most decent dogs can do PP as long as the basics exist genetically, its in the training.

Patriot K9 Services

by Patriot K9 Services on 21 August 2015 - 10:08

We've seen titled sport dogs in Afghanistan sent after a real bad guy that refused the bite because he wasn't wearing the familiar sleeve and acting as the decoy had acted in the past. Many trainers have never had their dogs take a real bite. A number of Schutzund trained dogs will only bite an arm and if it's not available are hard pressed to take a back, upper body, or leg bite. There's a big big difference in a protection/patrol dog and a sporting dog. We train all our dogs to continue under gun fire, lots of muzzle fighting, and other techniques one could expect in an actual protection situation. You've got to remember, an actual bad guy isn't trained to do what a professional decoy does in Shutzhund work.

beeker318

by beeker318 on 21 August 2015 - 16:08

It's always interesting to me to read other people's opinions. Seems like there are a lot of things that cause polarization amongst us- religion, politics and dogs! Here's my (very likely oversimplified) take on this). What I've heard a lot of people who participate in Schutzhund training say is that they do it because their dogs seem to like it. I'm sure that the further up the echelons of competition you go, the more intense it becomes. I wonder if that is a force of the sport or the people driving it, but it's probably not coming from the dogs. I don't see anything wrong with people wanting to entertain their dogs by providing physical and mental exercise for them, which seems to be why Schutzhund was originally created. On the other hand, it's very reasonable for people to want to win at a competition, so long as the dog seems to continue enjoying it, which to my observation, a lot of dogs do. It also seems reasonable that police K9 work, while similar on the surface, requires an entirely different type of mentality for the dog, because it's not about fun, it's about using the dog as a tool.

What I've observed during many years of GSD ownership involving several different dogs is that some of them excel in (and enjoy) parts of Schutzhund training, but it takes a special combination of dog to excel in all parts of it. So long as all parties like the effort put into competition, it's a great thing. The other thing I've observed from my dogs is that we form a bond and part of that bond is their desire to protect me. That enate desire on the part of the dog is one of the things that I so like about the breed. So, my response to the original question is that it's hard to create a full-blown protection scenario in training. Dogs pick up on endorphins and many other subtleties in real life that don't exist in the best training atmosphere. God bless them for that! Regardless of their abilities in the Schutzhund field, I believe and have seen that a balanced dog would naturally protect his pack/owner in a real life situation. I would not expect something undertaken as a game or form of exercise, which I believe Schutzhund to be at heart, to change the core personality of the dog. I think the trick is getting that balanced dog in the first place and nurturing the very traits in them that make us love the breed.

by vk4gsd on 22 August 2015 - 00:08

^ great post, props to all those that honestly train their dog....to do anything, and even more props to honest IPO folk, wish I could join the culture.

poo poo on those that pay to have their dog titled or buy titled dogs.





 


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