Anomaly outside of widely held belief about Defense Drive - Page 7

I have tested 2 weeks ago 2 brothers civil both 12 months old

Scenario street robbery in the dark robber also beat the dog with stick( wooden) several times
civil bite suit ( under normal  clothes), one dog directly goes behind the handler very confused (for me not a good dog), other dog have bitten the
robber without doubt good grip no weak nerves some fight on ground, decoy put some pressure on the dog dog stay in the fight very good  pushing grip, but decoy/robbery  let the dog win..
( very good dog for his age)

unexpected or before  trained scenario.

Gee I do that test with all my dogs number 1 test for me super test. Most dogs will fail without a doubt tie your dog back c what happens.

BlackMalinois - sounds like one dog did exceptionally well.
Re the other - don't write him off, try him again in three months time.

Yogidog - yes it's a very insightful test, you will know that most of them initially put on a brave face, Unfortunately that bravado soon evaporates, the closer you get. The key with that portion of the test, is not to zig zag, (putting the dog in prey)

Regards
Gee

Agree Gee some dogs mature some later (mental)

I see some nice training and scenarios with your dog keep on the good work.

BlackMalinois - thank you.

Dito - well done you for thinking/training outside the box.

Regards
Gee

Gee - your talk about your dogs putting people in hospital blah, blah, blah is just internet tough talk. already did the fat suit on the ground test so you are the "ignorant" one. and please do tell me what my dog's "element" is that he hasn't been taken out of. your ability to talk far exceeds your ability in anything else.

mith "My whole point is that there is a overly simplistic understanding in our working dog community that a dog primarily operating out of defense is necessarily a weak dog"

please state who specifically you are talking about - did you just make this up based on an imaginary "working dog community "???

YOU are the only one with such a "simplistic understanding "

and yeah I stand by that a strong dog won't be pushed quickly into defence - dogs 101.

False, Gee.
I work at one of the handful of kennels in US that provides dogs to special forces, I've seen a nice dog or two.

I think anybody seeing a dominant/confident defense driven dog with excellent nerves, and watching his/her body language (tail, ears, set of the hair, overall demeanor, position on the leash) would understand what we're talking about here. They just project confident "bring it on" dominance, and a dog's body language never lies.  

It is more than funny when people refer to such a  Defense driven dog,  with excellent fight and powerful hunt drive (not prey drive), as "weak". As somebody above stated, "Defense" as used here, is an over-simplification when defining the drive of these dogs.

" a dog's body language never lies. " but people's interpretation of it can, not aimed at anyone.

aaykay - you don't think most animal body language to a threat is anything but a lie??

the huffy puffy threat displays are exactly that, a lie to trick the attacker into literally thinking the animal making the defensive display is bigger and meaner than it is to hopefully drive away before the threat before it attacks - a range of animals do this to avoid a fight, and when it doesn't work they are on the verge of bolting.

you are twisting words I might add, nobody is saying a strong dog is weak, how silly.

I think people are saying that a lot of weak dogs are quick to defence - that is not saying defensive dogs are all weak.

the oversimplification is coming from people making imaginary claims to argue with.

VK: I think you completely missed the point, yet again.....what else can I say !

As an aside, if you think we cannot *easily* identify a huffy-puffy display as posturing ("huffy puffy" is also combined with a ton of other signs including raised hair, pulled-back ears, certain vocalizations that indicate fear/uncertainity etc etc that tell you a totally different story than what the posturing intends) , we are living in amateurville !