Who Do You Trust - Page 25

OK.

I can second the recommendation for Vom Reichtal.  I bought my foundation female Libby from them back in 1997.  They were honest, easy to work with and we have kept in contact over the years.  I have seen several other dogs from their breeding also that were very nice.  I couldnt have been happier with my Libby (she just passed in Sept at over 14 years old!).  I am really fortunate to still have her daughter and granddaughter with me now.  I would deal with Vom Reichtal again without hesitation. 

Thank You Joanro!!

One more point to consider, Blitzen, when does the "mutation" cease to mutate? You are very welcome, Gustav, my pleasure.

What is "cease to mutate"? How do you know that the gene that can cause DM is a mutation and has not been present in the breed since day one? 

Look, just do what you feel is right where DM is concerned. Anyone can go to the OFA database and research which dogs/lines have produced at risks. About half are listed using their registered names, the other half will always be unkown. Some are listed with sires and dam. Some are pictured here on the data base.  Test or don't test or test and ignore the results - your choice.

Are we so bottlenecked in this breed we have to breed dogs with DM?  or bad hips?  Where do you draw the line?  Isn't it better to know if your dogs have the DM gene than to play Russian roulette with puppies and puppy buyers?

  Most guarantees I see are for the first couple of years. So, if your dog dies of bloat or DM at five you are out of luck. 


Does anyone remember the thread on here about Nutro, and the speculation that the vit K in it caused DM?  I remember, because that is what I fed a dog I had that died at age 5 with symptoms exactly like DM, and it stuck in my mind. 

 

No, I don't believe that's the case, but when did and when does the gene mutate? If you have a herd of buffalo and any white ones are culled along with the parents you won't have any more white ones until the mutation occurs again. That's the way it is with mutations.

Joanro, unless there is sustantial data on the lifespan and causes of death in this breed backmassed to the foundation dogs, there is no evidence that GSD's haven't suffered from DM since day one. We don't know that anymore than we know that none of the foundation dogs had bad hips or bad elbows or peri-anal fistulas.

White in the buffalo is  the result of a mutation? I didn't know that. BTW mutated genes don't cease to mutate; they are passed horizontally from generation to generation in the same mutated state. 

 

RS, I don't remember that thread about VitK. If you happen to find it, I'd like the link please. Reading that and having a dog with suspected DM that was eating Nutro would make me suspicious too. 

IMO the biggest reason a lot of breeders do not test for DM yet is because some are not aware of the big issue.  Simple fact is some people haven't dealt with DM.  I haven't had a dog with DM or even known one in person who had DM.  I have heard the stories online and know it is heart breaking.  However, if someone hasnt spent the time on online message boards, it is possible they are not aware of what a problem DM can be!  For those who are aware of it, some do not realize there is a test available.  OR they may have heard of it but do not understand it.  They do not want to throw "the baby out with the bath water" and do not realize that the test isnt like that - you can still breed carriers and even affected dogs if you do it right - but most do not understand that! 

IMO it comes down to education!  And putting the breeders who do not test for it down is not going to help anything.  Having everyone test isnt going to happen overnight.  When I first started very few people xray'd elbows!  I was the oddball for doing my dogs elbows.  It was nice when others started doing it.... but it took quite awhile for everyone to jump in and even longer for it to be required.  Heck, from what I understand this is the first year USCA is requiring elbow cert for Kkl!!! It takes time. 

Educate people about the test, dont bash them for not doing it yet. 

And while DM is a heartbreaking disease it is just ONE part of the dog and ONE thing to consider when breeding.  I have seen some people advertise on this site with DM clear dogs yet their dogs are lacking in other areas.  That is no better IMO.  We always need to look at the whole picture. 

JMO of course
Valerie