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by Two Moons on 17 December 2013 - 16:12
ddr,
correct is the standard, incorrect is not.
I'm not good at mind reading either.
And I'm sorry but fear is not the foundation of defense, at least not the way I see it.
I go back again to the standards.
As for the lines and evolution since WW2, it'll be just another book on the shelf with many.
correct is the standard, incorrect is not.
I'm not good at mind reading either.
And I'm sorry but fear is not the foundation of defense, at least not the way I see it.
I go back again to the standards.
As for the lines and evolution since WW2, it'll be just another book on the shelf with many.
by Hired Dog on 17 December 2013 - 16:12
Ibrahim...A working dog does not need papers to be a working dog, never mind be shown. In my opinion, the show ring has destroyed all working breeds that biting was part of their required work.
ANY breed is suitable as a companion, but, working dogs must first work, be able to work, as they were not bred to be companion dogs but working dogs FIRST.
I dont know nor do I tell anyone what breed they should or should not get, BUT, they should not change the genetic characteristics of the dog simply to make it a companion dog...they can get a gerbil for that.
There are many dogs Ibrahim that because of temperament issues, not neccesarily bad, its just that some dogs are really hard and they will bite the handler under certain circumstances, I know, it has happened to me before.
Lastly, dogs have no idea who is innocent and who is not and because I have children, I choose certain dogs that can deal with them, but, in the past, I have had dogs that could not and they lived in a kennel outside. Believe me Ibrahim, as a father, I know what you mean, but, it does not make a dog bad just because it dislikes kids.
ANY breed is suitable as a companion, but, working dogs must first work, be able to work, as they were not bred to be companion dogs but working dogs FIRST.
I dont know nor do I tell anyone what breed they should or should not get, BUT, they should not change the genetic characteristics of the dog simply to make it a companion dog...they can get a gerbil for that.
There are many dogs Ibrahim that because of temperament issues, not neccesarily bad, its just that some dogs are really hard and they will bite the handler under certain circumstances, I know, it has happened to me before.
Lastly, dogs have no idea who is innocent and who is not and because I have children, I choose certain dogs that can deal with them, but, in the past, I have had dogs that could not and they lived in a kennel outside. Believe me Ibrahim, as a father, I know what you mean, but, it does not make a dog bad just because it dislikes kids.
by Ibrahim on 17 December 2013 - 16:12
Hired dog, though I am not 100% convinced, I respect your knowledge and expertise and your constructive debate 
by Jim Engel on 17 December 2013 - 16:12
I agree completely with Hired Dog.
Over the years all of our dogs were in the house
with our children, and I never had any concern.
But there are good and necessary dogs that
are not compatible with children, often because
they are good with family children but not their
guests.
Each of us has to take responsibility for the
dogs we breed and own.
But the most irresponsible thing, from the point of
view of the breed, would be to breed so that any
dog was comparable with any child.
That would be breeding gerbils.
Show line dogs are, generally, pretty close to gerbils,
but gerbils are preferable because they are supposed
to be gerbils.
Over the years all of our dogs were in the house
with our children, and I never had any concern.
But there are good and necessary dogs that
are not compatible with children, often because
they are good with family children but not their
guests.
Each of us has to take responsibility for the
dogs we breed and own.
But the most irresponsible thing, from the point of
view of the breed, would be to breed so that any
dog was comparable with any child.
That would be breeding gerbils.
Show line dogs are, generally, pretty close to gerbils,
but gerbils are preferable because they are supposed
to be gerbils.
by Ibrahim on 17 December 2013 - 16:12
Show line dogs are, generally, pretty close to gerbils,
but gerbils are preferable because they are supposed
to be gerbils.
I don't know what to say really ! was that necessary to amplify your point of view!
I have in my personal archive a description by PRESTON of a correct tempered dog he knew
Quote, Preston
Like I have said a number of times the hardest most correct temperamented GSD I have ever seen anywhere anytime was a GSD from a seeing eye kennel and sold as a family pet. He was safe around kids and friends but would go off like a rocket when suitably provoked, and all with no training at all, not even obediance. This dog was from Sinykin's LaSalle Kennels and was an import line from Germany back in the early 1970's. A truly astounding GSD. He had the look of eagles, great nobility, total confidence and that "don't mess with me or else" look of itching for a fight. He had "fire in the eyes". A local Sch trainer told the owner no GSD would stand up and fight an attacker without a lot of training when he took the dog to visit this local club. He told the trainer, heck no this dog will take anybody anytime. So the trainer suited up and said let him go loose. The trainer came at the dog and tried to run him off. The dog hit him directly head on and so hard it knocked his screen mask off, knocked him down and then the dog delivered a number of trepeated body bites in quick succession until the trainers screamed "get you dog off me". So this kind of temperament does exist, but it is rare these days. And I am not talking about unsafe "gangster dogs" who are a huge liability and hazard. The tough but correct dog being discussed is one that has good judgement, common sense and is stable and well balanced. A GSD like this is worth its weight in Gold.
but gerbils are preferable because they are supposed
to be gerbils.
I don't know what to say really ! was that necessary to amplify your point of view!
I have in my personal archive a description by PRESTON of a correct tempered dog he knew
Quote, Preston
Like I have said a number of times the hardest most correct temperamented GSD I have ever seen anywhere anytime was a GSD from a seeing eye kennel and sold as a family pet. He was safe around kids and friends but would go off like a rocket when suitably provoked, and all with no training at all, not even obediance. This dog was from Sinykin's LaSalle Kennels and was an import line from Germany back in the early 1970's. A truly astounding GSD. He had the look of eagles, great nobility, total confidence and that "don't mess with me or else" look of itching for a fight. He had "fire in the eyes". A local Sch trainer told the owner no GSD would stand up and fight an attacker without a lot of training when he took the dog to visit this local club. He told the trainer, heck no this dog will take anybody anytime. So the trainer suited up and said let him go loose. The trainer came at the dog and tried to run him off. The dog hit him directly head on and so hard it knocked his screen mask off, knocked him down and then the dog delivered a number of trepeated body bites in quick succession until the trainers screamed "get you dog off me". So this kind of temperament does exist, but it is rare these days. And I am not talking about unsafe "gangster dogs" who are a huge liability and hazard. The tough but correct dog being discussed is one that has good judgement, common sense and is stable and well balanced. A GSD like this is worth its weight in Gold.
by Blitzen on 17 December 2013 - 17:12
Not going to end up as working vs show, eh? Think again. I have to go feed my gerbil now.
by kitkat3478 on 17 December 2013 - 17:12
I am loving this thread...
Ibrahim, I couldn't agree more with your definition...
and ddr gsd get over the typo, I mean really...
Ibrahim, I couldn't agree more with your definition...
and ddr gsd get over the typo, I mean really...
by kitkat3478 on 17 December 2013 - 17:12
Blitzen, that just shows the complete "ignorance", of some people, I DON'T REALLY CARE WHO THEY ARE, OR WHO THEY KNOW....
That statement about gerbils is just 100% proof of an ignorant person.
That statement about gerbils is just 100% proof of an ignorant person.
by kitkat3478 on 17 December 2013 - 18:12
And yes, I am proud of my mostly showline dog that is certified dual purpose, active duty police k9. Yeah, he may be only one dog out me that has been certified, but could be he Is the only one that came upon a qualified dog trainer to get him to that point!
How many other great showline dogs just don't fall into the right hands? How many showline dogs are overlooked, that are 'more than' capable, also get left behind,not failed, just not given the opportunity....because one thing I have learned about the world of German Shepherds, and that Is that,"Ignorance Rules",
How many other great showline dogs just don't fall into the right hands? How many showline dogs are overlooked, that are 'more than' capable, also get left behind,not failed, just not given the opportunity....because one thing I have learned about the world of German Shepherds, and that Is that,"Ignorance Rules",
by kitkat3478 on 17 December 2013 - 18:12
Oh, I thought I read somewhere that the capt. was quoted as saying, "i NEVER MET A GERMAN SHEPHERD THAT DID NOT LOVE CHILDREN"
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