Questions Re. Structure and Jumping - Page 10

Its grate that yo can larrn so much on this site. Im learning grammar and spellings  VKi is lerning not to through a skick .Realy statring to like this site.some very good threads with v good posts .Ok going for something to eat maybe a peice of bread what u think blitzen  .Seriously thanks for sharing your knowledge

I don't beleive any breed has the wright structure for jumping exept the fila who despite his massive bones can clear a sixfood fence with ease. The only breed that i know off who has somewhat cat like joints.

Cat's evolved for  jumping wolfs did not.

Interesting discussion, I don't normally hang out on the GSD side of the forum but I saw the title regarding structure and jumping.  Someone asked earlier in the thread if there were photos of some of the Malinois in the jumping videos.  I don't have photos of those dogs, but do have these photos and videos.

Ares

Still looking for a decent standing side shot

this is the best I can find, but he was only about 18 months old, so not yet a mature body.  He's also not as cowhocked as the photo appears, was just standing that way

Kita

Kita actually injured her cruciate in an accident in the back yard after this video was taken, but I have a very similar video (still jumping this height) taken about 1.5 years after the injury, which was treated with conservative management (no surgery).

Two different standing shots of her, one was more alert, the other more casual, she was also a little younger in the left side photo.

For comparison, this is Cali in the foreground.  I don't think I have any videos of her jumping online, but she had no problems doing 4.5m on the long jump and 2.3m on the palisade, could have gone longer/taller.  However, she did have issues with the 1.2m hurdle, 1.1 she could do no problems, but 1.2 was about a 50/50 chance of her clearing it vs hitting the bar.

Thank you, Maindobe!  It's very interesting to see the differences in structure.

If those dogs were GSDs they would be considered to have weak backs, as the croup is slightly higher than the back, and in some photos, there is a slight dip where the back meets the withers. And, of course, no trace of an arch/roach.

She makes those jumps look SOOO easy! 

One thing that is interesting is that these dogs have a fairly typical structure for the working Malinois.  Slightly longer than square, amount of angulation, topline, etc.  I also routinely see a more sloped croup in working dogs.  A stacked photo might show them better, but these were all in natural stances which doesn't hide the flaws as well :-)

Compare this to the Malinois that you will see in the show ring, or the other Belgian varieties.  I just grabbed a few random images off of google.  I'm not making a statement about these individual dogs, because I don't know them or anything about them.  But I do know that in general, the Belgians I see with this typical conformation structure are not as good of jumpers as the working line/built dogs.  They aren't bad jumpers, but they aren't as good.

I am not familiar with show and work types of Malinoise but this dog has more front angulation

than this one

To my eye, the croups on your dogs look to be higher and have more muscle. And, as any horseperson can tell you, that will make for a better jumper!

The mal I posted at the start of this thread is also a working line mal, and is from an ad that says he's a littermate to the #1 dog in the AWDF.

SS,

In horses, when the croup is higher than mid of back and when croup has more muscle, that is considered a plus for the horse in jumping?

Ibrahim, I can't say that's a hard and fast rule, because different breeds of horses have different structure, and, of course, the horse also has to be willing to jump, but, yeah, more muscle in the butt should mean more jumping power!

My part-Arab mare was a really good jumper for her size (only 15 h.) She had a butt like a draft horse!!

All horses are designed so the croup is higher than the back. The lowest point of the back is just at the end of the withers. And that's another reason I don't buy the roach-back-is-stronger theory! An animal that's capable of carrying a fully grown human can't have a weak back.

Pictures of different breeds of horses:

https://www.google.ca/search?q=Arabian+horse&gws_rd=cr,ssl&ei=sOK2VMqSFrj_sASP2IKICA#q=thoroughbred+breeds&stick=H4sIAAAAAAAAAGOovnz8BQMDgxoHsxCnfq6-gWFhcW6yEgeImV1eUKDF61SUmpoSnJmSWp5YWRyxx3fVy2KxlIr-W613W0OM71X26gEA3fQoiUMAAAA