Drive in Showline GSDs - Page 2

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Harrisonsgsds26

by Harrisonsgsds26 on 13 July 2015 - 18:07

I've only seen 2 showlines worth feeding both Kirschental dogs years ago

by Blitzen on 13 July 2015 - 19:07

Well once again posters fell into the black hole by trying to say something positive about showlines. Could we ever have just one conversation started and responded to by showline owners that isn't interrupted by snide remarks about their dogs. Maybe we should start to jump in on every workingline thread saying ugly things about those dogs too? They're not pertect either you know. This is a German Shepherd forum.


by Mackenzie on 13 July 2015 - 19:07

Don't worry about the comments Blitzen.  Just keep counting the failures on the working side and see how many dogs some of the trainers/owners get through every year in trying to find that top dog.  

Mackenzie


by old shatterhand on 13 July 2015 - 19:07

Blitzen is very correct I would even say that the working line dogs are not much better these days than show line dogs,and they are much uglier looking than they were 30 years ago.The advantage they only have is that the breeders of working lines and some owners spend more time in training those dogs in Schutzhund,i think they are more knowledgeable in this than show line people and i would have to say they are more devoted to doing that.Show line people also spend the same amount of time with their dogs,but they beside schutzhund training,they have to do ring training,excercising and condition the dog,get him ready for shows,when working lines owners focus only on Schutzhund,and don't care about nothing else.Saying that procentage of good dogs from both line is very similar,and if the working line people would take the showline puppy and raise him,i think there would be not much difference later between these two lines.


by SporterGSD on 13 July 2015 - 21:07

@old shatterhand

I couldnt agree more with your statement.

 

I`m fed up with the whole working vs showline. This started out as a discussion about a certain showline bloodline, pos and negs can be mentioned, but if anyone wants to do the old working vs showline  pls do it in the applicable thread

I do know that the Pakros-Bax-Odin line is prone to temper, dental problems and cow hocks. But it is also a very good producer of robust immune systems and good hips.


by Blitzen on 13 July 2015 - 21:07

If You Don't Have Anything Nice to Say, Don't Say Anything At All


by Ibrahim on 13 July 2015 - 21:07

Mackenzie,

 

That is a much better picture for the back part though it isn't as good a back as that of the dog you posted in your earlier post, my opinion (as a matter of fact after Blitzen's effect, which I thank her for )


by Mackenzie on 13 July 2015 - 21:07

Ibrahim, please remember that every problem cannot be laid at the feet of the Sires.  The females also contribute something.  Not all breeding families behind the Sires and Dams are compatable.

Mackenzie


Cutaway

by Cutaway on 14 July 2015 - 15:07

@old shatterhand - I understand your statements but have to disagree... We have both "show" and "working" line dogs in our club. One of our show line got his his IPO I under a real judge and even though it wasn't a great showing of ability, his IPO I was truly earned and he is going for his II in Sept and his III at our regional. There are a few other show lines from the club tat are coming up and will get there working titles this year as well. But make no mistake about it, there is a universe of difference between the drives, character and confidence between these Show vs working line dogs. Based on what i have seen, and not just in my club, showlines break under much less pressure and have a longer recovery time. They hit avoidance at lower correction levels where the working lines dont seem to be as affected by it. I have also noticed the showlines tend to be more vocal under stress and have a longer learning curve. Again this is just based on a very limited exposure to GSDs with in my area of the US (NV, AZ, CA, CO). One such exercise is training the dumbbells working the hold,  and no, i am not talking about frying a dog with Elec.

Our members value the baseline necessities and believe that EVERY GSD, regardless of the line, must due the following: BH, AD, Show Rating, Bite indentation / teeth record, OFA & A Stamp, IPO or HGH, Breed Survey. I am very biased against the show circuit but believe that showing is a necessity! A GSD MUST have the proper structure. And getting ready for a Show is no easy feet. Trying to teach a dog to gait properly is just as hard as teaching precision healing. I yes, I find you show people amusing out there double handling outside of the ring looking all goofy. But i have to assume you think us working folk are just as goofy trotting up and down the field looking like we have a stick up our buts trying to keep out mannerism so serious.

The one thing in common we all share is that we want healthy dogs and get enjoyment out of watching owners being active with their dogs doing something

 


by Gustav on 14 July 2015 - 18:07

The topic is about " drive" in Showlines.....I have never understood how you can intelligently discuss subject matter without discussing the pros and cons. Actually, I don't know how anything can improve or be maintained without both positive and negative input to make decisions. We have " haters" on the board that will only emphasize the negatives of certain types. You also have "apologists" on the board that never want to see or here anything negative even if it's true. Both camps are detrimental to the breed in terms of growth and maintenance because they refuse to see the breed from balanced view( both positive and negative).
When discussing drives in Showlines, I think it's common knowledge that this has been an area of the Showlines development that has diminished over the years. So an intelligent conversation about this subject should be about the current state of drives in SL and how to maintain or improve. Also, which lines that appear to throw decent drive as opposed to those that are lacking. To discuss this subject without bringing up negatives( in this particular area for SL) can neither be helpful or beneficial,imo. Doesn't mean folks have to be nasty or hurtful, but if one says something factual or accurate this is how we can improve deficiencies. We have to get past hate and enablers, if we want to maintain or improve. There is no perfect dog or line, but true growth cannot come from ignoring deficiencies or tearing down the good aspects of a breed or line.





 


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