Drive in Showline GSDs - Page 3

cutaway if structure is important why do you have to "teach a dog to gait" that seems absurd and contradictory.

 

Uh.........The OP's question was- Has anyone else noticed outstanding working ability/quality in this specific line? He didn't ask for opinions or debates on showlines in general. Anyone wishing to expound on that or attitudes of showline owners should probably start a new thread?

But the title is; 'Drive in Showline GSDs ', leaves the discussion open. Nothing will ever improve without debate, which means being honest.

There is a difference between discussion/debate and hurtful descriptions and generalizations about the type and belittling one's choice in the breed, Gustav is right as long as we all respect other's choice, say our opinion humbly without jumping on each other and be rude to owner or type of dog.

The show people need some room here, sometimes, for smooth discussions without worrying about a working guy coming along with a hammer in his hand, show enthusiast should feel ok to post and talk about his/her type without being belittled or hurt with vulgar words and terms about his type of dog

The question was about specific lines asking opinions from anyone who had those lines.

I`ve owned and seen males from the bloodline: Pakros d´Ulmental - Bax von der Luisenstraße - Odin vom Hirschel

In general I can say that all of them were outstanding in pigment, above average in size, featured high withers

Most outstandingly I found that they were all very strong in Drive as well as Temperament and highly intelligent ( I have other GSD males to compare to)

Has anyone else noticed outstanding working ability/quality in this specific line?

If yes pls link , I`d be very interested to see some pedigrees

The showline vs workingline vs showline has already been beaten to death on this forum but if it's still of interest to any, then start a new thread and talk about it again.

 

Any disrespectful, nasty comments will be deleted.....end of.

On topic, maybe there isn't a single line in the show that we can describe as strong and has outstanding working ability, reason is lines have been watered through generations of crossbreeding of lines. During my search for a show puppy I was advised by a German breeder to try and buy a puppy from a breeder who pays attention to work ability like Kirschental or Arlett and forget about what line the dog is, what you say?

Excellent advice, Ibrahim. I think the reason for lack of drives is because of selection process...the priority is not on drives in shows dogs, but appearance.

I wonder then, is the Avg level of drive found in showline dogs today has been done on purpose? In another thread regarding working Red/black GSDs, someone pointed out that the sable was not a desired coat in show breeding and therefore, through breed selection Red/Black and Tan/Blacks are more dominate coat in the show lines. So then, would this same scenario be true here, higher drives = less desirable?

i think there is a difference between drive/s in the modern sense and work ethic. ime albeit limited, many SL on average lack both for a good reason.

drive/s as usually used in the modern sense has been intensely selected for in the modern WL GSD in order to be competitive on the field because of the ability to do lots of repitions and accelerate learning of precise technical excercises, try that with a low drive dog if you are stupid enough.

such demands were not required of rustic practical working dogs who imo had less "drive" but were more balanced and had a greater work ethic and stamina for the long haul jobs.

 

add in the post 9/11 global demand for detection dogs has again increased the need for crazy levels of drive, here the mali had a distinct advantage until GSD breeders re-grouped and are now answering back, trying going to a WL website or listen to anyone here that does not boast EXTREME prey/hunt etc.

 

OTOH the demands to do well at show do not require a high drive dog at all to be successful, in fact the biggest market for GSD, the pet home, high drive dogs are a PITA imo and cause nothing but drama, leading to excessive use of crating, e-collars, re-homing etc, etc cos in spite of what the casual pet owner thinks they want, they actually do not want, or can handle an extreme prey/hunt/civil dog.

 

when breeders start getting puppies returned because they have become the owners worse nightmare it is only logical they will select for lower drive dogs in the future.

this situation is the same imo for evey working breed there is, a low drive docile family friendly version; low drive pet GSD, low drive pet ACD, low drive pet Kelpie, mal, malamute, husky, pointer, wiem.........same thing plays out, pet folks want the status but not the "baggage" that comes with an intense work animal.

 

low drive GSD SL are the perfect market solution to cater for the mass market, not a thing wrong with that per se, as long as they are healthy and preferably docile and always bigger versions of their WL counter parts. in fact now the trend is for oversize, docile, low drive family friendly dark sable dogs and the greeders are hard at it producing them.

the buyer has to be educated and realisitc and they will get the dog they want regardless of drive level.

 

that's my novice take on it.