Hunt drive does it compliment fight drive in protection work? what do you say. - Page 1

How many handlers have a dog who wants to bite into the body suit and adjust the grip deeper , and shake the decoy as he was killing him? Dutch dogs or really hard dogs with high hunt , and fight drive do this..Malinois ,Dutchies have very high hunt drive , now lets get one thing strait ball drive is not hunt drive, regardless of what trainers say this is not the same. A dog who works in hunt drive wants to take the sleeve or body suit and wrap his paws and not let go,the same dog does not want to give up the bite .Now when the same dog takes a stick hit or a tag from the whip will bite harder and fight harder from the contact from the decoy.

So do you as dog handlers or trainers does hunt drive and fight drive work hand in hand or do you think its something else, I would like to hear what you have to say.

I hope people that are new to Malinois and working dogs in general do not take the things that you are posting as being written in stone.

How many dogs have you titled personally or decoyed to a title and in what sports?

My experience goes back to 1988 competing in schutzhund , police dog trials PCAA decoy for 4 yrs,training director westfield boro police deptartment with shaun bradford for 2 yrs,security k9 director for 7 years and last sport competed in was PSA.

I have titled several dogs of my own and client's dogs over the years and as far as what I post works and I stand behind the advice that I give,I dont see allot of trainers helping new malinois owners but at MJA k9 we do.our program enhance's genetics with out conflict.

Any new mali owner should learn to read between the lines and train with others who are best for your dog ,whether it be sport work,police or having a dog that will do what you want, and to be open to train out side the box.

I don't believe that Hunt Drive has anything to do with Fight Drive. Hunt Drive is the inherent desire to search for something, Fight Drive is a synthesis of Prey/Defense/Dominance. Two independent things.

John

Hi John I am glad to see you read what I posted , yes they are two independent drives . I posted to create conversation about drives and what poeple think they are and what they really are and how to use them to get the best out of the dogs.

I see allot of people say hunt drive is to search for a ball,but that can be called ball drive or search drive , the same can be said for a dog who is sleeve happy,but a really strong dog with high hunt drive will want kill the sleeve or the full body suit.A dog who has high hunt drive will bite deep and shake his prey, here's an example ,the decoy is calm and does nothing to stimulate the dog, you tell the dog to bite as the dog is bitting he should bite deeper and shake the decoy and stay on the bite until you give the out command, the same dog really wants to bite and not give up the prey.

There is another way at looking at our dogs drive's, have you ever heard the term " raw aggresion" that term refers to the dog who has high hunt,and fight drives those are the strongest dogs and need very little work to bite and fight the decoy,the control is the hardest to teach those dogs.

so what you are saying is that hunt drive is fight drive.

"A dog who works in hunt drive wants to take the sleeve or body suit and wrap his paws and not let go,the same dog does not want to give up the bite .Now when the same dog takes a stick hit or a tag from the whip will bite harder and fight harder from the contact from the decoy."

Hunt drive is not fight drive they are two drives that should be balanced, a dog with high hunt drive can do sport,but to perform   KNPV,NVBK or policek9 the dog needs to handle allot of pressure .They prey type dogs can do well,but most fall short when the decoy gets hard on them,now the dog with high  fight drive can  deal with hard decoys and handle the pressure .

I prefer dog with high hunt and high fight drives that are equal.

You have some interesting viewpoints.

My opinion is hunt drive and fight drive are two totally seperate things and unrelated.

What you are describing is prey agression which you could call a pre-curser to fight drive. Properly channeled, prey aggression turns into fight drive.

What dogs have you titled in PSA, what levels, and at what trials, if I may ask?

I have trialed to PDC and am training for PSA1  now that I have enough decoys I would like to go further with my dog.I am glad to see you understand the two drives that are being talked about.How is your new club going? was it OJ's club that you were talking about? on one of your posts?

"They prey type dogs can do well,but most fall short when the decoy gets hard on them,now the dog with high  fight drive can  deal with hard decoys and handle the pressure ."

Huh

Note to self...be sure to tell other 1/2 that I have learned that his PSA 1 titled dog is not working in prey as we have thought all of these years, it should have been obvious to us that it is actually very high fight drive that helps him take on strong pressure from hard decoys.