Mink Fero Timmy Troll - Page 1

Hi Dear friends, I just want to know why is there a wave of people saying that these lines are no more popular. I just want a very objective opinion no dissection or mud slinging and neither is my intention to malign people who are breeding on these bloodlines. But whenever I have talked to people about owning a dog from these lines they say that these lines are old. What are the newer lines then?? Please excuse my ignorance I'm just a novice in the GSD world and trying very hard to learn and what better platform than this site. Please give your valuable inputs regards Vikram

Which Troll do you mean

troll von der bosen Nachbarschaft hope the spelling was correct

lets see.... 0 nerve, bad hips, health issues, unwillingness for starters. Some of the last Fero dogs were probably sired by Timmy or another Fero son since at least a couple of litters were "bred" by Fero after he was dead. Mink was owned/titled by Randy tyson in CA, she sold the horrid creature back to Germany and for some odd reason, people started breeding it. If Mink was such a great dog, don't you think Randy would have kept something from him or kept him ?

what then are the working bloodlines of the future and the latest ones?? regards Vikram

Hey Vikram, Great question! Any response to this question is subjective. I have a female that is bred 3-5 Fero. She OFA'd "Fair". Her Sire and Dam are both sch 3 and HD- a1 normal. This female gives great attention in obedience, tracks very calmly and has good calm grips. As for nerves, she is very confindent when confronted by the helper even as a young pup. Too confident. It took some work to bring her bark out. When people say they do not like Mink Fero Timmy Troll I would guess they do not like line breeding on any one of those dogs. I have heard that here can be nerve issues, size problems and missing teeth. I personally have not seen any of these problems. I am aware of the Mink Fero Timmy Troll bias in the USA but I am not aware of it in Europe. Then there are folks that like to breed on Yoschy. But if you are breeding on Yoschy you are breeding on Fero thru Troll. People also point out that Fero had a huge number of breedngs but only produced a small number of BSP participants. How many Fero progeny were in the hands of persons capable of reaching the BSP? If you look at BSP participants its similiar to the USA Nationals in that the same names appear in the top 20 year after year. If someone is going to give you a response that Mink Fero Timmy Troll progeny have bad hips, nerve issues, and poor health it should be quantified. Does Mink Fero Timmy Troll appear more than once in the pedigree? Have they observed the dogs with issues or just heard about them? Vikram I hope you get the response you are looking for and I hope our GSD friends in Europe will give us their thoughts on this topic. Kyle

Kyle your opinions are so positive and objective that they really touched me. This is the kind of response I was looking for. As we all know in lot of Sch1 II III trials its the handler errors which disqualifies/point deductions the team rather than dog errors. I also had suspicion that this wave of opinion against these bloodlines would be more "camp" based as you have rightly said. Even I have observed the same thing that these lines are still popular in Europe. I just wish that more knowledgeable people would give their discreet opinions since this questions has put me in a big dilemma before I go in for the dog of my choice regards Vikram

While I am not a big fan of Fero in general, and don't have any Mink in my lines, I find M. Carter's reply particularly prejudiced, rude and downright ignorant in every sense of the word. True, there are some environmental nerve issues with Fero bred dogs, but if we want to get into mud-slinging about dogs who have working problems, the showlines have a cornucopia of dogs to critize. Same with hips, working ability etc. Didn't someone recently say the board was to take a new direction??? And if Lasso, Yasko, Cash etc etc etc were so great - why did they get sold??? Actually - Mink was titled in the US and went back to GERMANY to found his own bloodline. How many showdogs can you say THAT about??? Anyway Vikram, one of the "problems" with the Mink - Fero lines is that they were so popular and widely used and crossed that it is difficult to find dogs without them in a pedigree. I have 2 females who are Mink and Fero free, and breeding them has and will be done to have litters free of those dogs as it is rare to find and of value as an outcross. I may also have a litter to a dog with F/M in the pedigree one time, but further back - it is just hard to find a dog without these now. Fero had nearly 1400 progeny, some great, some ok, some horrible..look at any popular sire and I bet there are alot of washouts from them, and only a small percentage is sucessful. The sucessful ones go on and are utilized heavily. Same here. The lines I see doing well are lines from Belgium - particularly Orry v h Antwerpa, and Lord from East Germany. I also like dogs with Xento Maineiche in their lines, and in fact, if Fero is crossed with Xento, don't mind having that cross...a Fero - Xento grandson won the BSP a couple of years ago.

Thanks dear Kougar, Again a very well balanced opinion. Thanks especially for pointing to the newer lines warm regards

To say that any *one* dog is responsible for creating nervy, unsound,unhealthy progeny is insane, particularily when that one dog is located in the 4th,5th or 6th generation! Look at the two dogs the breeding is BASED on, and move from there. If the mother or father is pure junk, (nervy etc), do not expect the puppies to be ANY better, and do not blame that on the dogs in the 4th,5th and 6th generations. I agree with Kougar in regards to the tone and lack of class and true KNOWLEDGE of the dogs being discussed here. Of course, judging by the ads M Carter has placed, his/her taste in dogs seems to point towards those lovely black and RED showpieces, so I would suggest you take their summation of Mink, Timmy-Troll and Fero with a grain of salt. JMHO