Police Body Cam Video K9 bites suspect in face ............... - Page 4

Oh the Germans can kick ass with anyone on Earth .. they just don't feel the need to unless the situation warrants it. Quite different from US cops who escalate and use force at the first opportunity in quite a lot of benign situations. Deacon you are as usual blowing cop smoke .... I had a foreign visitor from Brazil who got a DUI in Germany and he refused a breath analysis. They took him to jail and drew a blood sample. Not a mark on him and he said the German officers were very kind. I picked him up at 2 AM in the morning from the local police station and drove him to his hotel .. $400 fine and he didn't have to stay the night .. 3 hours in jail, back to his hotel sans auto and tucked him in to sleep it off. The police thanked me for picking him up and paying his fine so that they were rid of him. Away from the US bases you seldom see a German police car at least not in the smaller towns or on the autobahn. Around US bases the MP's are out in force learning their trade for the US police system I suppose. The recruitment of military police for police work in the USA has only made the problem worse as military police are known for being brutal and for not worrying about busting heads as their brass will cover for them regardless of how out of line they are. Just like the police in the USA seem to think they can rewrite the laws and hurt people because they are protected by their chain of command and the brotherhood of silence.  The cops in the OP's video were way out of line and they knew it .. they were just showing their true colors and forgot about the body cam.  More body cams and less unnecessary injured and killed people on both sides of the law but the thuggery must stop.  The Germans respect their police officers which is not how many Americans feel after seeing that what our police do is not the same as what they say they do  ... they lie and cover their corrupt actions without shame.

I read a study somewhere that in general (not all) ex millitary personal make real shitty cops.

Policy when our military go to a war zone on peace keeping missions the soldiers hand over to our cops as soon as possible, the soldiers be as invisible ad possible and our lightly armed cops restore stability much more effectively.

That idiot Westmoreland never learned this and got lots of people killed to the tune of millions, arguably unnecessarily.

Soldiers and military mind sets may not be good for police work it would seem. Wonder if this had anything to do with the problems in the US and elsewhere. That's not bashing cops its respecting them as cops not para-military units.

Boy, Bubba, you really see (read) only what you want. Where on my post did I state that my brother's dog did not out?

And since you know nothing about my brother's dog I consider your comment to be totally ignorant.

Zweigsd this was your exact words  ....  "Also a real bite is a LOT different than training -- sometimes that perfect "Out" or targeting in training doesn't work too well in a real situation. My brother had a GSD that would target the face even though he was trained on the arm."

A police dog must out and a police dog should never target on the face, neck, or groin .. those are killing zones .. Your post indicated that not outing was OK " in real situations" and that some dogs target the face. Neither is acceptable and a dog with either fault should not be a police or even a protection dog. Police dogs are often misused by their handlers and if a dog is sent and attacks a child or youth targeting the face or neck a death could result. Since there have been too many instances of police invading the wrong house with children present I would suggest that police should always expect that persons innocent of any crime are inside a building or residence and that sending a dangerous dog or using lethal force without provocation is illegal and unjustified.  The dog will do as trained and commanded which is why the training must be solid because those commanding sometimes are not qualified.  A police dog should not attack children, should not target areas likely to cause death ( face, throat, groin ) and should out and leave the target on command.  In some protection sports one test of control is to send the dog and then call the dog back before engaging the target ... sometimes at the last possible moment.  A police dog should be able to pass such a test but I would wager 50% or more of active duty police dogs would fail.  If protection sports are to have any validity the ability to recall a dog after released or ordered to bite a target is an absolute necessity and should be a part of all biting sports.  Before anyone sends their dog in anything other than controlled practice they must know that they can call the dog off before biting or out and recall after biting.

Bubba I think you're just used to the WLSL pd their much softer and don't have real aggression true WL are harder . in real situation u can not predicted every move nobody knows the hole story of that video. Somethings I don't like but the dog not outing straight away is not one .

Still did not point out where I said my brother's dog did not out. And, I certainly am not going to go into the factors with you that would make that dog target the face.

I said the PERFECT out -- as in one command and the dog instantly releases. Never did I state that a dog on a real bite does not have to out.


"Before anyone sends their dog in anything other than controlled practice they must know that they can call the dog off before biting or out and recall after biting."

You just stated it right there -- practice is controlled. You work on all these things with a dog in practice but you don't have control over a real situation. The dog could always be 100% in training but in that real situation something could cause him to react differently. You try to train for all different situations but it is impossible to cover everything.

Ah, but in Training, Zwei, you should always TRY for the 'perfect' result. When you succeed, you make it more likely that the dog in a 'real' situation will still "do the right thing" (despite outside circumstances, whatever 'somethings/distractions' happen). If the attitude at TRAINING is laisse faire,  that likelihood decreases.    I think Bubba may have it right - that

underlying your posts is a  'so what, it can't be helped'  sort of attitude  - not from what you say, but from what you omit

to say - and I find that worrying if it is a widespread thing.

Evidently I have to write a million word post to cover every minutia of how I train so that others will not say, "Well you DIDN'T say this or that". I was trying to explain why the Mal in the video may not have instantaneously outed or why he may have targeted the face. You can train and train and train and sometimes as much as you want it to, it doesn't go as planned. And that can go for anything in life, not just dog training.

To jump to the conclusion that the dog is no good, the training is no good, the police are no good just from the video is ridiculous. I am tired of people passing judgement before all the facts are known.

"A police dog must out and a police dog should never target on the face, neck, or groin..."

Absolutely untrue.

The police go to great lengths to obscure, deny, and outright lie about facts .. before video cameras and cell phone videos they got away with it. That is the crux of the matter isn't it?? Cops routinely lie when it suits their purposes and helps them cover their butts. Before we had proof of their lies and misconduct those unaffected by their brutality and sometimes assault or murder in the so called "act of policing" supported the system of lies and false statements police have used for decades to cover up their misconduct. People like Grossman and Deacon pretend they are experts but they are just pretenders as are many K9 handlers and police K9 dogs and join in the lie fest about what is legal and professional as it suits their ego and questionable conduct. Clearly from the original post the fact that you have a badge and a gun and a dog does not make either the K9 handler or the dog actually qualified to be called police or K9 police officers. The police certification tests for police dogs require a clean out without question. No police department would admit to allowing or condoning a face or neck bite nor would any bite likely to cause death be sanctioned. Of course as we have seen on video too many times to count what police say and do is very often neither what the police claim is true nor what actually happens. Video cameras and cell phone video is all that stands between citizens and police anarchy as we have seen over and over again ... and these are just the 1% of the cases where video was taken and shown.