color question - Page 1

I adopted a female shepherd from a "breeder" who was not taking care of her.  She came with AKC papers as well.  She is black and cream colored and when I started to add her to the pedigree database, I realized that both of her parents are registered as solid blacks. I was under the impression that black genes were dominant and that if two black dogs bred, the resulting pups would ALL be black.  Is this true?  Or is there a tiny possibility that 2 solid blacks can produce a black and cream?

no chance - two black dogs would ONLY produce solid black puppies - NO other colors possible.  Either the parent's colors were incorrect (one dog was black/tan) or one or both parents were not correctly named.

molly

Molly is correct. Two solid blacks can ONLY produce solid blacks.

A "Solid Black"is defined as a dog with no tan/cream between th toes.Often these dogs are mistakenly called solid black when actually they are blk/tan,being a small amount of tan between the toes can be overlooked by the amateur eye.I once had a bi colour whose parents fit that description.

Many - possibly most - black dogs have tan or grey hairs between the toes, and some as they age develop brown or tan or grey up the backs of the legs as well.  They are still genetically  black and will not produce black/tan or bicolor dogs, if they are genetically black dogs.  There are "melanistic" bicolor dogs who are almost completely black except for between the toes and minimal tan on the legs - but bicolors no matter how dark will have tan around the vent (under tail) while blacks will not.

molly

Impossible for black & cream to come from true blacks. 

Have you ever seen a black GSD pup with ONLY brown front feet? The hind feet, vent, face, undercoat, etc are black. Sire is dark sable, dam is black & tan. I've never before seen "socks" only on a GSD's front feet. (I know the breeder, so , no, it's not a mixed breed.)

Its very difficult to find true blacks. The history of the dog needs to be studied very closely.

Pharaoh has gold/tan between his toes.  Every inch of the rest of him is solid black.

I think he is solid black.

Michele

black is recessive in GSD not dominant

The gene for solid black is the most recessive gene.  It is not dominant.  A black and tan dog could carry the solid black gene.  A Sable dog could carry the solid black gene.  A bicolor could carry the solid black gene.  Every dog has two color genes to give to its puppies.

Both parents must carry the solid black gene to get a solid black dog.  The puppy will have to inherit the solid black gene from both parents because it will need TWO solid black genes to be solid black.

A solid black dog has only solid black genes to give to its puppies.  If a solid black dog is bred to a sable that has no gene but sable, all the puppies will be sable and they will ALL carry the solid black gene.

That is why two solid black parents can only produce solid black puppies.  That is because they have no other color to give to their puppies.

A litter can have more than one father involved if there are some really sneaky and clever intact males around.

Pharaoh's father Aron and mother Sindy are sables that carry the solid black gene.  To me, they look like they carry the black gene because they are so dark and have the penciling on their feet and tar heels.  There were two solid black puppies in the litter.  Some of the puppies were really dark and some sables were lighter.



Michele and Pharaoh vom Banach