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by Xeph on 14 February 2010 - 04:02
Preston, could you comment on what I'm seeing in the fronts of Ajax and Eryx? I felt their fronts were pushed a bit far forward (though overall I find them to be very harmonious and balanced in structure), do you disagree? If so, what is it you like about the front? Thanks ^_^
by Samba on 14 February 2010 - 05:02
I do like the Chuckie bitch. I have a grandson via Hudson v Kalten Hardt.
In recent history, it looks to me like the Univ. Siegr. honor has gone to working dogs. Some of them of better conformation than others. As I cruise around "looking" I seem to find more nicely conformed WL dogs. Glad for this and these breeders should be recognized heartily. Now to have a good breed show specimen gain in working ranks would be awesome also.
I fear the ASL dogs would need a fair amount of concentration on working characteristiics to bring us many dogs of good looks and good works. But, maybe I am out of touch! If I am not, this reason would be why the ASL is currently not in the running for "best in the west" as far as excelling at production of a total German Shepherd dog.
In recent history, it looks to me like the Univ. Siegr. honor has gone to working dogs. Some of them of better conformation than others. As I cruise around "looking" I seem to find more nicely conformed WL dogs. Glad for this and these breeders should be recognized heartily. Now to have a good breed show specimen gain in working ranks would be awesome also.
I fear the ASL dogs would need a fair amount of concentration on working characteristiics to bring us many dogs of good looks and good works. But, maybe I am out of touch! If I am not, this reason would be why the ASL is currently not in the running for "best in the west" as far as excelling at production of a total German Shepherd dog.
by Preston on 14 February 2010 - 22:02
Xeph, I have not seen Ajax or his top son Eryx in person, but I have been told that they have nice front construction and are better in person than their photos would suggest. Ajax's photo is unclear but it appears to show the scapula laid far back, based on two factors: the depth of the white hair line back from the prosternum and the length of neck. A pushed forward scapula and/or upper arm (often they co-vary) usually is accompanied by a shorter appearing neck. In his photo Ajax appears to me to have been over stretched a bit. Had he been photographed in natural pose I think this front angulations would have appeared close to the ideal specified in the FCI/SV standard.
Eryx has a very short back and loin (close coupled), a slightly better wither, a pronounjced prosturnum. His scapula appears to be laid back quite far ased on the white hairline appearancve and neck that appears quite long. To me Eryx is about as good as it gets with GSD conformation and reminds me of the great dogs of the lates 1970s and early 1980s in Germany.
Both dogs appear to have proper angles and length to their upper arms and scapula, proper setback, good prosturnum, ideal croup length and angle (the hardest thing to get). It has been repoprted that both can open up and extend in the rear with no sickle hocks, both having powerful rear drive which makes each dog efficient in movement. The darker the GSD (blacks or very dark sabkles) the harder it is to judge their angulation unless one looks carefully close up. Prosturnum however is easy to see, as is length of back, angle and length of croup, and rear angulation. Usually a good forward extending prosturnum is accompanied by good angulation of the upper arm and scapula and good layback of the scapula.
Both of these GSD are better than 90% of the V rated GSD out there as far as conformation. Certainly their temperaments are ideal and few showlines have temperament this good. We know Ajax can produce it, but it is too early to say about Eryx. I would expect Eryx to be a top producer or ideal working temperament based on what is behind him. To me these GSDs are what we should be breeding for. Imagine how rich the pigment could be if nice and dark black and red top showline bitches were bred to these excellent males.
Eryx has a very short back and loin (close coupled), a slightly better wither, a pronounjced prosturnum. His scapula appears to be laid back quite far ased on the white hairline appearancve and neck that appears quite long. To me Eryx is about as good as it gets with GSD conformation and reminds me of the great dogs of the lates 1970s and early 1980s in Germany.
Both dogs appear to have proper angles and length to their upper arms and scapula, proper setback, good prosturnum, ideal croup length and angle (the hardest thing to get). It has been repoprted that both can open up and extend in the rear with no sickle hocks, both having powerful rear drive which makes each dog efficient in movement. The darker the GSD (blacks or very dark sabkles) the harder it is to judge their angulation unless one looks carefully close up. Prosturnum however is easy to see, as is length of back, angle and length of croup, and rear angulation. Usually a good forward extending prosturnum is accompanied by good angulation of the upper arm and scapula and good layback of the scapula.
Both of these GSD are better than 90% of the V rated GSD out there as far as conformation. Certainly their temperaments are ideal and few showlines have temperament this good. We know Ajax can produce it, but it is too early to say about Eryx. I would expect Eryx to be a top producer or ideal working temperament based on what is behind him. To me these GSDs are what we should be breeding for. Imagine how rich the pigment could be if nice and dark black and red top showline bitches were bred to these excellent males.
by Preston on 14 February 2010 - 22:02
Samba, I do like the looks of that Hudson dog too. That Chuckie bitch is a top producer and if I was breeding I would try to get a good bitch out of her that looks like her in type. I can see whay you would enjoy a dog from her heritage. This is very valauable blood.
by Preston on 15 February 2010 - 19:02
Slamdunc (Jim) ask me how can I know a dog will bite without any serious training. I did not put a sleve on and provoke the black dog of Metz's breeding. I did spend a substantial amount of time observing him close up and saw how he reacted when I made a sudden movement. I have been around GSDs for many, many years and some have an unmistable look of eagles, the eagle eye. This is a look in the eyes of complete and total confidence, an aggressive predatory look signifying "don't push me". It is unmistable when one sees it in puppies or adults. It always accompanies strong territorial dominance accompanied by a high fight instinct (many call this defensive drive). Some have called this "fire in the eyes". It was obvious to me that this black dog would bite if pushed, and his owner described him as very tough in the home. I have tested GSDs over the years and those with this look will stanfd their ground and will bite when suitably provoked with no prior training. Protection rainuing can in many cases mask a dog with weak temperament. I have always liked to test them with no training.
One sees this much more frequently in european WL dogs but it doers occurs in some GSD in all lines occasionally. The hardest GSD I ever owned was one I bought as a 7 week old puppy out of V rated in show top working line parents. The sire and dam had this look of eagles or fire in the eyes and so did the puppy I bought. He was by far the most aggressive puppy in the litter and the only one with this look. He had fight drive that was over the top and yet he was stable and friendly to family, friends and young children. At night or when we were gone during the day he patrolled the inside of our home with a vengeance.
I picked one kennel to use as an example who has some WL GSDs that I like. I especially like their stud dogs. Some of their dogs have this unmistable eagle eye or fire in the eyes look. Just look at their puppy page and you will get the idea.
http://vombanachk9.homestead.com/puppies.html . A couple of their puppies which are first appearing in photos on this page have this look.
I am not saying that GSDs who do not have this look cannot have great working temperament and a strong fight drivwe or territorial dominance. I have had some which did. But they did not have this "over the top" fight drive whichis so highly preferred.
One sees this much more frequently in european WL dogs but it doers occurs in some GSD in all lines occasionally. The hardest GSD I ever owned was one I bought as a 7 week old puppy out of V rated in show top working line parents. The sire and dam had this look of eagles or fire in the eyes and so did the puppy I bought. He was by far the most aggressive puppy in the litter and the only one with this look. He had fight drive that was over the top and yet he was stable and friendly to family, friends and young children. At night or when we were gone during the day he patrolled the inside of our home with a vengeance.
I picked one kennel to use as an example who has some WL GSDs that I like. I especially like their stud dogs. Some of their dogs have this unmistable eagle eye or fire in the eyes look. Just look at their puppy page and you will get the idea.
http://vombanachk9.homestead.com/puppies.html . A couple of their puppies which are first appearing in photos on this page have this look.
I am not saying that GSDs who do not have this look cannot have great working temperament and a strong fight drivwe or territorial dominance. I have had some which did. But they did not have this "over the top" fight drive whichis so highly preferred.
by Ibrahim on 15 February 2010 - 20:02
Preston, excellent info and views.
Ibrahim
Ibrahim
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