BIG heads, super dark sables, super hips. That is the problem

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by adlerbach on 23 February 2010 - 17:02

Thankyou Preston regarding Ajax. He is also an extremely HARD dog. His wonderful father, my beloved Narro von der Kine, SchH3 in Germany with 100-96-100, was a hard dog also but social whereas his son is a handful :-) Narro passed two years ago at 12. Ajax's mother Xanja vom Haus Reinius SchH1 is a young 13.5 yrs. Ajax, Berro and Chip are all with me as is the Czech dog, Polo and of course, the young female, Strut. Barb

by Kalibeck on 23 February 2010 - 18:02

Some of the dogs with the 'big blocky heads' remind me of chow chows...not a GSD....I like a darker dog, but to me color is the icing on the cake, a nice bonus, but not the goal in itself.

The hip thing, tho' ....are you saying we should not disqualify a dog from the gene pool if he/she is excellent in all other things, for less than perfect hips? I, having an excellent male with good ancestry who has bad hips, have been thinking about this a lot lately. How much can this be corrected by stringent breeding practices? Wouldn't it have been corrected by now if the equation was as simple as breed good/excellent to good/excellent & get good/excellent?? Or have breeders been breeding dogs with poor hips irregardless, to promote other qualities??? Or does it just crop up occassionally, no matter how carefully breeding stock is screened, & if so, what is the point of rating hips/elbows?? You have a great depth of knowledge about canine genetics, Hans, I have read some of your previous posts, & you know your facts, could you help me understand it better? Thanks, jackie harris

by darylehret on 23 February 2010 - 18:02

Being selective for solid black IS STILL BEING SELECTIVE FOR COLOR! More than half the requests I've received in the last 5 years were about 80-85% males and 80-85% solid black. Anyway, I'd guess probably another 80-85% of the buyers looking beyond color are almost exclusively looking to import. I would trust very few breeders here, to pick anything BUT the color. Even some popular overseas vendors can't answer simple questions beyond sex and color of their litters. Repeating the questions in the following messages gets you the same results. No, I'm not talking about Jinopo. Maybe, but I've never asked them any direct questions that went unanswered (about their litters, anyway).

by DebiSue on 23 February 2010 - 18:02

I haven't seen any really big headed dogs on here (thank goodness!) I have seen some really ugly heads on ads for "big headed dogs" and I cringe at the thought that our breed could end up with an oversized head like a bulldog. The dogs I see here so far are very handsome examples of what we want to see. I know most everyone has a color preference but color is no big deal to me but I still want to see OFA stamps.
Deb

by VomMarischal on 23 February 2010 - 18:02

My old bitch has a horrible big head, bigger than most males' heads. Ridiculous. I for sure bred away from that. It's a really bad plan to try to get secondary male sex characteristics in females; they just don't breed as well when they're "mannish." Girls need to be feminine, and that is a statement that bugs me to death as a feminist but Oh well, it's reality in the world of nature. I did not pick a stud for my upcoming litter based on his color or the size of his head; he is a rather light sable with a medium frame, not even massive bone. But dear god can he work! Jyl found him for me, and she definitely found the right one!

by Sunsilver on 23 February 2010 - 19:02

Quax von Danischen Hof had an extremely short, broad head, and produces that in his progeny, especially the males. It's a trend I'm not at all fond of seeing. One poster on the PDB used to breed Siberians, and they did this with the Sibe showdogs, and wound up with a dog that couldn't keep its tongue in its mouth, and had trouble breathing!

Here's a head shot of my very first GSD, Lilli Marlene. All my girls have had very nice, femine heads.

by sueincc on 23 February 2010 - 19:02

Prager I am SO glad you brought this up, because it's a real issue as far as I'm concerned. I see more and more working line breeders (who should know better) tossing out the term "black sable puppies" and you and I both know the only reason for saying that particular color is because it's a sales ploy for people who can be swayed by such a thing, who just looooooooooooove a color. It's no better than show line breeders who talk about their "beautiful black & reds". dumb dumb dumb and really bad for the breed. Anyway the way it was explained to me is a black sable only refers to a sable who can throw blacks, not the coat color.

We all have favorite colors in our heart of hearts but only a fool or someone destined to be unhappy buys a dog because of it's color.

by Slamdunc on 23 February 2010 - 20:02

Here's a picture; I didn't buy him for his color though.

by Jyl on 23 February 2010 - 20:02

Nice picture of him Jim. He sure looks alot like Dante Traho.

by Slamdunc on 23 February 2010 - 20:02

Hey Jyl,
Thanks! That's what Debbie says. He also has his temperament.

Here's one of him relaxing on a lounge chair by the pool:

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