how common is civil drive? - Page 8

I think "man with a gun" stemmed from OP making the comment about man with a gun and doesn't matter if you have a GSD.

What happens for whatever reason if the "master/owner" is incapacitated? i.e.; medically, accident, knocked out? whatever reason. The dog won't be reading and will conclude/act on his/her own?

back to orignal topic  ? I beg!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 I guess you didn't read all the posts where it was answered. There is no such thing as civil drive. At best it is a marketing tool. Dogs are either civil, or they are not. There are not many dogs out there that are like this to begin with. A drive assumes that it is in every dog, and that is just not true.

Just because you can train a dog to bite a human doesn't mean he is civil. 

"Magical" connection..good one...makes me wonder why do you guys even have dogs than? If according to your responses dog should not be able to use it's brain...I agree there is no true classification for civil drive...but if your dogs are limited to commands and no brain activity...maybe its a good thing since they have you guys for their owners ...:)

Now, nothing personal....rule is...must be able to take it if you are dishing it out...right :)

Oh and Jeff...Dozer came from animal shelter at 7 months he was 24 pounds and was skin and bones, he HAD a small wagon of issues...just as an FYI regarding whimpering comment...I would have loved to import dogs, breed them and pick out the perfect puppy....than proudly show what I produced...ehh..one day when I grow up  I wanna be just like you! 

 If you really want to be like me, then you need to understand how silly your assessment of your dog is. You could of had a medical emergency right there in front of your neighbor and the stupid dog runs him off. What if you had went down, and really needed help and your stupid stupid magical dog is out there running the paramedics off the property. 

You see what I mean about choices ?

I am glad that you took him from a shelter and gave him a home that really does care about him. Don't think that I am playing that down. He is not the problem, YOU ARE ! ! !  : ) 

You can take this as smart ass all you want, but the fact that you were in pain, and could of needed help is not funny to me, so I am going to scold you. Do NOT let your dog do things like that unless you tell him to.

The whole akc natural protector shit is cute and all, but dogs are not brilliant creatures 99.9% of the time. They need to be taught when to do things and when not to.

I wish people could see for themselves what those natural protector types really do when confronted with even burlap in a first training session.  Most the these dogs owned by novices from the pound type dog give a good front out of fear.  Not sure that i would call this protective though.  I the wild animalss do this , put on a big bluff directly before retreating.  Even dogs thatwill bite naturally vs trained will not stay in the fight.  Any one have training footage of the natural protector in a begining session to post.

Where by the way can i get one of those mistical dogs?

Or Jeff does it have to be the magical type?

Will a mistical type do?

trouble-- you bring up a valid point !! i can take a dog with a temperamnet flaw.. now this is where i forget about the word civil ... it's irrelevent in this context.. this temperamnet flawed dog I can trian to do protection work .. even personal protection ... [ everyone has outlooks and their opinion ] . take my experience.if you wish / or not !! . as stated a thousand times ...ad nauseum at that ,   on this PDB.. if you do not get into the head /mind/ heart /essence of the canine.. if one is determined to be categorical .. this is where one will eventually get into trouble .. and as you state 'trouble', most definately novice s[ to whom my post are generally directed to BTW]. you are correct .. certain exhibited behaviors can errantly have one believe a canine is civil [ that is by their definition]. we are defined by the thoughts we have , the language we use to communicate.. heavens help someone if they think they have a civil natural protecto , rwhen in reality they have a dog that aggresses out of uncertainty for survival - simply beacuse they have learned from experience that biting people may be the route to SOLVE their insecurity problem ..
   i had a friend with a high line , best in the world belgium  working malinois .. as a pup this canine aggressed .. she wanted to do  sport ..she  thought he would work well ... [ andya ..  i could have gotten this dog titlred ] BUT ... she misintepreted his aggression for being a great worker... well , even after proper socialization , this dog was a danger to even consider to walk down the street .. oh ya .. she had a so called civil dog alright [ in her mind]!!!!  BUT in reality .. this dog had genetic / isssues .. go near this dog and just even look wrong ,  never mind twitch your finger wrong .. you would have been bitten in less time than you saw the bite coming ^** .. IMO i don't care about labels .. just show me the dog .. the dog tells me who and what it ios ... IMO --i don't need descriptions and novices .,..  be careful for what you wish for you just might get it !!.

people are so quick to state..."YOU are the problem" not the dog and I agree, dogs are what owners allow them to be..however Jeff, pointing finger and jumping on my example is like 5 year old saying My Daddy is bigger than your daddy...childish...if you disagree which you are...feel free to say it without making it insulting with commens such as magical blah blah because simple minded people jump all over it and make a discussion into a trash with their pointless comments....
I agree that we disagree and I prefer a dog with brain activity when you prefer a dog with a piece of paper and robotic response to a verbal command....great...at least we both know what we want. :)

here is a scenario....you are walking with your GSD (in fair comparison lets say it has not gone through your ideal training) a person gives you a weird look by looking at you up and down, your dog looks back at the person you correct him, person turns around wackes you in the head you are down..here is your dog looking at your rolled up eyes waiting for a verbal command...person checks your pockets finds that u only have ID, $2.00 and a house keys....looks at your dog who is siting next to you waiting for the command since he can't do anything but follow your verbal commands...attacker calls dog..gives him a hand to sniff..you are out cold....attacker pulls on the leash and walks away with your dog who he will sell for 200.00 at a flea market...

i know you gave example above regarding your size, places u walk in, etc....not all of us are 6 feet.....i  used word  "you" loosely..

I will agree that if medical issue comes up i may be in danger..but in this day and age chances of me being attacked are higher than having a heart attack so I will take my chances with a thinking dog...

Ladyfrost, I don't get your scenarios or argument. You just said the dog wasn't trained. Why would he be waiting for a verbal command? And if he is trained, most train their dog to not react to someone being belligerent, but if they engage, so will the dog. It's called control. As to your argument, you stated earlier that you want a dog to react to you and not the stranger, so how does this scenario fit into your argument?

 It is more magical this way. Better chance to get on the Disney channel.