This is a placeholder text
Group text
by Pirates Lair on 31 May 2011 - 04:05
Yes they will, and while I have great respect for well bred and trained sport dogs, our dogs are not sport dogs.
And while I hope my dogs never have to engage anyone, your welcome to try and get in my car or yard anytime.
Kim
by wanderer on 31 May 2011 - 04:05
Try my house too. And while I'm on the subject, I have an old crippled "show" dog that will take you down if you come in without one of us with you!
by Ace952 on 31 May 2011 - 17:05
I was under the impression that Sch was used to test the workability of a dog and not necessarily just "protection dogs". Hence it having 2 phases. Generlly speaking, I don't think it is hard to find a good protection dog. There are plenty of places to look and find one. It takes some research and word of mouth but it isn't hard. Paul you seem like you have a lot of experience and knowledge so I wouldnt think it would be hard for you to find some.
I don't understand where this whole thing that Sch dogs can't be "real dogs". I think too many people see oen or 2 examples and judge every dog that does do Sch as a dog that can't protect anything. I think too much energy is spent on pointing out what they think the dog can't do without seeing if it can do it. I think people don't look at the handler and the trainer. I would look at the handler and find out if they care for a "protection dog". Maybe they like the sport and it is all they want their dog to do. There are others in the sport that also can do "real serious" protection with their dog. Again it falls on the handler & what they want along with having the right trainer. You have old czech dogs that did Sch and other competitions and still were working dogs that could protect, so to say a dog does Sch means that eh can't be a real protection dogs to me is nonsense. To me I see it as a matter of training....simple as that.
We often see people talking about "old stye dogs" and hwo they were so great. Dogs today SHOULD be better than dogs 20-30 years ago. I would be concerned if a breeder was still breeding the same type of dog as they did 20 years ago with NO improvements.
by GSDPACK on 31 May 2011 - 18:05
What exactly do you want? Where do you live? Maybe somebody in your area works their dogs in PSA? there are some dogs that do Schutzhund with their dog that might just be civil....
In the last litter I had a civil puppy.. he is a little something. the owner might be a little over his head with that one but he now knows what a civil dog means.. he did not believe me when I told him. He cant even do puppy tug (or he shouldnt) with the puppy.. he takes it a little seriously.
good luck in your search
by myret on 31 May 2011 - 18:05
I must agree with you on somethings like not avery dog trained i schh is a shitty dog ,but I don't agree that the gsd has improved alot over the last 20-30 years
I have seen many dogs from 80's and 90's and they had the first far more prey drive than many of those you see today, and the old type dogs, they had many of the old lines had a much larger fighting spirit than it is today and hard nerves could tolerate the extreme hard
by myret on 31 May 2011 - 18:05
forgot to write the last.
dogs today many of them could not withstand the hard traning methods they used in the old days they would losse drive because of harsh training because todays dogs are far more handler soft and easier to work with than the old lines.
by Ace952 on 31 May 2011 - 19:05
I mentioned that dogs being better than dogs from way back in the day b/c I too thought that dogs in the past were vastly superior than the dogs today until I went to a seminar hosted by Jiri Novotny of Jinopo. He mentioned how todays dogs (that they breed) are better dogs than what they had many many years ago. Better temperament, more well rounded, healthier, etc. This just coming from better breeding and knowing more as times go on. I will agree that the term "a lot" is subjective. I do now though believe that I should be able to get a GSD now that is better than one from 20-30 years ago.
I think we also need to clarify what kennels these dogs come from that people think are such "shitters" as well. It is more about who is breeding them instead of just having blanket statements that no one breeds civil hard dogs. People who want "real dogs" aka civil dogs complain that sport dogs are breed too much for sport. Sport people complain that people want all these "civil dogs" just to show they got a dog that can bite somone and they are clear headed. It could be said that both groups aren't breeding for balance. Prime example of the pot calling the kettle.....
by Ace952 on 31 May 2011 - 19:05
I think breeders produce more of what people want. Many know that while a lot of people ask for that type of dog, they really can't hendle the dog. I think a handler sensitive/responsive dog is something that should be promoted but again there are those that like for their dog to be hard or even aggressive towards them as they feel it makes them a harder dog. I always see handler aggressive as a dog not clear headed (unless maybe the handler isn't being fair to the dog when it comes to corrections or something?)
by Ace952 on 31 May 2011 - 22:05
Just want to add that just because a dog is a sport dog doesn't it is a real dog.
I think the term "real dog" is a joke.
by Chaz Reinhold on 01 June 2011 - 03:06
Contact information Disclaimer Privacy Statement Copyright Information Terms of Service Cookie policy ↑ Back to top
