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by EchoEcho on 02 February 2012 - 05:02
Why does it matter if a trained or non-trained working dog will bite (unless it is a police dog)? Do people really use their dogs for serious protection? I use my dog as a deterrent for someone breaking into my house. If someone still breaks in with my two barking GSDs then they probably mean business and will mace, taser, or shoot them.
Seems like if you are that paranoid you would want to get a permit to carry a concealed weapon and spend your time at the gun range. You can train yourself how to use a gun for a lot less time and money. In Colorado if someone breaks in and enters my house I can legally shoot them however, if my dog bites them they will probably sue me. Hard for them to sue me for a dog bite if they are dead.
Seems like if you are that paranoid you would want to get a permit to carry a concealed weapon and spend your time at the gun range. You can train yourself how to use a gun for a lot less time and money. In Colorado if someone breaks in and enters my house I can legally shoot them however, if my dog bites them they will probably sue me. Hard for them to sue me for a dog bite if they are dead.
by Two Moons on 02 February 2012 - 09:02
old redundant topic same as the last time.
guddu your information is not entirely correct.
guddu your information is not entirely correct.
by duke1965 on 02 February 2012 - 12:02
forget all personal experiences , because non of those will be representing the big picture
at all comes down to what drives and in what levels of each drive your dog has , if you have a mainly sport/prey driven dog he will not protect from itself , and if the intrudor emptys your purse and throws it away , your dog will probably retrieve it , also , if this type of dog is trained , it will bark/maybe bite on command , but that will give some problems while your sleeping or after being nocked out
if you want a real protectiondog , I think you should look for a dog with natural suspicion and high defence , lower prey drive , these are the dogs that become rare , as they are not wanted in sport and showlines , and therefore not used and selected frequently
they will protect naturally and training can be limited to make sure you have your dog under control at all times and the command out , generally speaking
at all comes down to what drives and in what levels of each drive your dog has , if you have a mainly sport/prey driven dog he will not protect from itself , and if the intrudor emptys your purse and throws it away , your dog will probably retrieve it , also , if this type of dog is trained , it will bark/maybe bite on command , but that will give some problems while your sleeping or after being nocked out
if you want a real protectiondog , I think you should look for a dog with natural suspicion and high defence , lower prey drive , these are the dogs that become rare , as they are not wanted in sport and showlines , and therefore not used and selected frequently
they will protect naturally and training can be limited to make sure you have your dog under control at all times and the command out , generally speaking
by Bob McKown on 02 February 2012 - 14:02
mfh27:
That video is the dumbest thing i,ve ever seen....
The biggest predetermination to protection in my opiniopn is the relationship you have formed with the dog.
by hunger4justice on 02 February 2012 - 14:02
duke1965...How right you are. That is why in another thread, I said the one exception to titles/and certifications are a dog that really works, that epitomized the courage and uncanny ability to sense evil and intent, before formal training, that has shown it has the courage to keep on coming no matter what is before it, the kind that only death alone will stop, HELL YES I make an exception for an exceptional dog.
The average trainer does not like this type of dog, thinking the dog is lazy or do not know how to motivate the dog. I have seen this myself and had trainers go from saying the dog wont bite to the dog is so civil it is unsuitable for sport as it bites for real (and could care less about the sleeve). Same dog, same trainer. I think I have a balance now in the dogs I have. However, I really like the German Shepherd that could not give a crap about bring a ball back fifty times but sure would go through fire and broken glass, take a bullet and still keep coming to protect the one they are bonded with. There are dogs like that and they are one in a million and getting more rare all the time. I have had them and I have seen them, and most people on here would not want the dogs because they would be hard/harder to title in schutzhund and if you don't treat them properly you'd lose a hand or worse. I LOVE those kind of dogs..In fact even my Leefdaalhof grandson was a dog I wanted because the other aspects of Tom, hardness, stubbornness, civil were shown in my dogs sire on the street as a law enforcement K9. What he did to protect his partner and earn dog hero of the year meant more to me than the WUSV title his dad holds.
"if you have a mainly sport/prey driven dog he will not protect from itself , and if the intruder empties your purse and throws it away , your dog will probably retrieve it"....LOL!!!! I love it.
Also so many think defense and fearfulness is the same. There is a great study of the genetics of GSDs that show defense and COURAGE are almost at a one to one link genetically. Aggression is separate and maternally linked, fear and sharpness is yet a separate category according to the study.
People forget how important what Bob said is...the bond. If you have your dogs kenneled and only take them out to work them, you will never have that same bond.
Sita's Mom, my experience is that a lot of the really good old line European show dogs are high in defense, so I am not surprised.
Echo, if they are going to try to get through your GDSs you better go right to the gun and forget the taser or pepper spray. And don't miss.
The average trainer does not like this type of dog, thinking the dog is lazy or do not know how to motivate the dog. I have seen this myself and had trainers go from saying the dog wont bite to the dog is so civil it is unsuitable for sport as it bites for real (and could care less about the sleeve). Same dog, same trainer. I think I have a balance now in the dogs I have. However, I really like the German Shepherd that could not give a crap about bring a ball back fifty times but sure would go through fire and broken glass, take a bullet and still keep coming to protect the one they are bonded with. There are dogs like that and they are one in a million and getting more rare all the time. I have had them and I have seen them, and most people on here would not want the dogs because they would be hard/harder to title in schutzhund and if you don't treat them properly you'd lose a hand or worse. I LOVE those kind of dogs..In fact even my Leefdaalhof grandson was a dog I wanted because the other aspects of Tom, hardness, stubbornness, civil were shown in my dogs sire on the street as a law enforcement K9. What he did to protect his partner and earn dog hero of the year meant more to me than the WUSV title his dad holds.
"if you have a mainly sport/prey driven dog he will not protect from itself , and if the intruder empties your purse and throws it away , your dog will probably retrieve it"....LOL!!!! I love it.
Also so many think defense and fearfulness is the same. There is a great study of the genetics of GSDs that show defense and COURAGE are almost at a one to one link genetically. Aggression is separate and maternally linked, fear and sharpness is yet a separate category according to the study.
People forget how important what Bob said is...the bond. If you have your dogs kenneled and only take them out to work them, you will never have that same bond.
Sita's Mom, my experience is that a lot of the really good old line European show dogs are high in defense, so I am not surprised.
Echo, if they are going to try to get through your GDSs you better go right to the gun and forget the taser or pepper spray. And don't miss.
by Judy P on 02 February 2012 - 15:02
| The biggest predetermination to protection in my opiniopn is the relationship you have formed with the dog. |
by beetree on 02 February 2012 - 15:02
I'm in hysterics! Thanks guys, feels like old times, LOL
by Carlin on 02 February 2012 - 16:02
I have a mutt that is more likely to protect than my GSD. I have a wl on the way soon I have high hopes for, if she doesn't pan out I may "bite the bullet" and find a rotty.
by mfh27 on 02 February 2012 - 17:02
But Bob, that video was scientific!
Hunger, please link the study you talked about. I'd like to read it.
Until people start talking about what kind of dog actually saved them or protected them, its all just speculation.
Hunger, please link the study you talked about. I'd like to read it.
Until people start talking about what kind of dog actually saved them or protected them, its all just speculation.
by duke1965 on 02 February 2012 - 17:02
even with the best bond you can have , if your dog is all prey , no defense , he will not recognize a threat if he sees one , maybe if the criminal runs away with your laptop , his preydrive will kick in , but lack of bitingequipment on the criminal will stop him from biting anyway
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