A Noob's Guide/Journey to a Personal Protection GSD - Page 3

Peter cho said it all better than l could but to answer the question what is a full blown tactical ppd ofcourse its dog speak so this type of dog maybe called many things i've heard lots of names but in the post there is description of testing dogs on hidden sleeves so at that point in training the dog is happy to bite a person without equipment a very grand thing as long as all the stars are aligned and as to who sells all these dogs that eat these people not I personally I wouldnt touch that with a ten foot pole. all three cases that I have testified in all the purchased dogs came from kennels that had websites advertising ppd to put this into perspective the school where I work requires 480hours of training before trying to certify after that the k9 team will need minimum 16 hours a month just to maintane training standards these standards are very similar to standards that a court of law expects a resonable person to adhere to show his due diligence trust me I've set and watched two of the ppd owners lose everything including one's freedom

lol bhall

Peter Cho,
I agree that $25K after training would be close to what one would/could spend when all is said and done. What I haven't seen is anyone show me a $25K dog that impressed me say $12K worth more than the other dogs.

Kipka,
I understand where you are coming from and believe me I'm not taking this lightly. As far as the 3yr old goes I hope they put a bullet in the dogs head. I also think a lot of these issues could/can be avoided if the human is properly trained and understands his/hers and the dogs limits. I also don't believe a PPD has to be a dog from hell. I like Malinois but decided against getting one because I feel/felt that they add an extra element of potential issues that is not needed in my case.

Kipka, I also understand where you are coming from and I am sure you know that most of our dogs go to PD's.
99% of the time when I am contacted about a PPD I actually tell people to adopt a dog at the local shelter. Most of the time these people need a dog that barks in the yard and nothing more. 
Even all of our K-9's have to be very social dogs. A good K-9 or PPD does not have to be a dog from hell.

    Well, in all fairness to this evaluation, I remembered this post from awhile ago and thought I would RE-POST some others experiences and opinions when they went to meet Hans;

by Slamdunc on 18 July 2010 - 16:07

Slamdunc Posts: 3940 Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 12:46 am

Actually, I have met Hans and visited his kennel and home.  Every December I go to Scottsdale for a Pancreatic Cancer fund raiser.  On my last trip I went and met Hans and saw his facility and his dogs.  His Kennel was cleaned and well maintained and his dogs were healthy and well cared for.  His home was beautiful and his dogs at the house were impressive to say the least.  Obviously, "K9 trainer" has an agenda and is doing the usual PDB back handed slander.  Gotta love the Internet, you can bash anyone in complete anonymity with out posting all of the facts or the whole story.  You can then change screen names and post as several people.

by ELM on 18 July 2010 - 20:07

ELM Posts: 4 Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2010 08:15 pm

I don't usually get involved with little squabbles but this made me join today so that I could post a response.  I recently bought a pup from Prager at Alpine K9.   During my research I asked him if I could come out and visit before I bought a pup from him.  His answer was "Yes"  My wife and I made the 10 hour drive out to his place and met him and his girlfriend.  I was impressed with the cleanliness of his kennels as well as the number of beautiful GSD's he had.  While I was there I saw this litter of 13.  All of these pups looked healthy, happy and very playful.  I can attest that none of his dogs were sick and none of the pups were sick.  I chose a beautiful female from his Quint/Erin litter and four weeks later returned with my daughter to pick up our pup.  The second visit was just like the first.  Very clean with a bunch of healthy dogs on the premise.

      Just a reminder, everyone SEE's things differently.
And yeah, I do appreciate the info Hans so freely shares with ALL of us here looking to learn.

I have personally visited Hans' and Debbie's home and kennel in Arizona last year, for a seminar, and can attest to the above posts by Slamdunc and ELM.  Yes, he does have dozens of dogs, but then any large, diverse and legitimate breeding program needs that, I suppose.

I am also truly appreciative of what Hans freely shares on these forums and also other venues.

Michael Cox, I think you did a very thorough and professional job in getting exactly what you want and feel good about....I commend the breeder/owner and I am happy for you. ( I'm on my way out this morning to train all day with Sheriffs dept with a 14 month future police or ppd dog. )  I think your process reflects the same principles as breeding and training, in that there are several ways to achieve success, but you can always stack the deck in your favor . Good Luck!

Kitkat,
Yes, I met Hans and his wife Debbie who were charming and very gracious.  I did see the Kennel and the dogs there.  The personal dogs Hans had at his house were nice, I didn't see any dogs work.  Time changes things and my opinion certainly has changed.  Personally, I would not include him on my vendor list now for my PD or for a dog for myself.  If other people are happy with him great.  I don't wish him any bad will just that I would consider other sources for a dog for sport, pet or Police work.  

To be clear, I would not endorse Hans nor do business with him.  I'm sure Hans knows this and it really makes little difference to either one of us.  There are plenty of people for him to sell dogs to and plenty of others that I would gladly do business with.  

A good P/P K9 needs to blend in until it's time to goTactical, otherwise you might show your hand to soon.

Gustav, thanks for your input. I always appreciate your posts.

J Basler, you hit the nail on the head!


To all others I knew there would be some with hurt feelings and feel the need to champion for their favorite breeder/dealer, please remember this is just my opinion based on what I saw. It doesn't mean that you can't buy a dog from XYZ breeder/dealer. It's okay if we don't all agree on who to buy from we all have a very different view on what clean is I'm a Marine so for me there really is only one type of clean but I also understand that it's all relative.

Please don't turn this into a breeder/dealer turf war!