Working line cross - Page 6

no problem :)

  Well I have been crossing SL and DDR lines for years, and am very happy with the results,

oni, 

I haven't heard from you in a while. I think I sent an email or two but didn't hear back. The dogs are both doing great! There was recently a picture of us in the news because I saved a young child's life that was choking.      I was named Trooper of the year for Troop L recently. I credit Reddy for making that happen. He is so good at what he does.

"Bad boy" Mason is doing very good. He and Reddy have so much fun together. Mason is trained so well now. He has competed in some trials and has done very good. Even though he isn't trained for protection like Reddy is, he is very protective of me, my wife and kids. 

How are you and your dogs? We have a new K9 school starting shortly if you had any dogs that are about a year old that you wanted to donate (I know you get attached to them as they get older though). 

In a few years it will be time for me to start training a new work dog. I will have to look to you for that! 

I hope all is well with you. I will send pics soon. I don't have any on this new computer. 

Chris

Both dogs this trooper is referring to are sl/wl crosses

Well...how r their working skills? Are they titled? Do you have any working videos of them? (obedience and protection work, playing etc.).

The black and tan male is a police dog now, still a crap dog in my opinion.

Bronxter, no problem on your English. I figured that. My point was not at you, but at the breeder; I don't care WHAT line you cross with what, if the dam is terrible, you are not going to get great pups. Period. That speaks to basic breeding, not so much crossing lines! 

BTW, I have had much the same experience as you with regard to old, strong west working lines and throwing a bit of GOOD east blood in there. High drive, calm in the house, and with a very good nasty side. They've made a wide range of handler types happy. They may not be perfect (no dog is) but they are heads above others in several categories, ie, they do many things very very well, unlike some who make one person happy and another hates them. 

every mix you make and every outcome is different, so if one or two strike it lucky it is no guarantee for all other mixes, be it with showlines, west/czech, mali GSd or whatever

Then I understood it also wrong, sorry for this.

And yea, you are right. The female is the basic for breeding. And she has to be a good one.

I'm sure some people have been lucky enough to get some 'good' results crossing show lines and work lines but i think these people are the exception. A large part of the working gene pool is already poor enough, why further water it down with show line dogs?  Yes you have a right to breed whatever you want, but i think people doing these breedings should be honest with themselves and not in anyway imply they are trying to combine the best of work and structure because the stereotypical showline structure s flawed. Wolves do not have arches in their hindquarters.

    How many of these cross breedings have produced top sport competitors or strong police k9s(Not patrol car ride alongs)? If you really want to improve the breed, become friends with a good breeder, get a strong female and breed to some of the better males around and keep keeping your best females. We do not need more slant backs, weak grip dogs in the GSD genepool...It's bad enough already.

Police dogs are not the best GSD .. just good for police work.  Police are not the best humans so why would they have and train the best dogs.  It is a small minded assumption that equates a job or excellence in sport to superiority in all things.  Football players are not the best athletes or human beings.  Cops are not the best humans nor are police dogs the best dogs.  Excellent show line dogs when mated to excellent workiline dogs produce excellent offspring.  Poor quality working line dogs produce poor quality offspring and poor quality working line dogs mated to poor quality show line will likely produce poor quality offspring.  The sire and dam predict what their offspring will be not titles or labels.

Bubba, what fact in your life has caused you to become such a bitter, negative person?

Because you know so much about the subject.. I suspect that you have handled, trained and worked many PD dogs with many officers. You have also crossed sucessfully generations of Show/Working line dogs to show exactly how super they work. Because you have put titles on dogs, many and to a higher level, because you have participated in PD trials with your dogs and you have learned that your IPO3 dog does shitty job at protecting you on the streets.....

THAT IS WHY YOU POSTED THIS CORRECT

Police dogs are not the best GSD .. just good for police work.  Police are not the best humans so why would they have and train the best dogs.  It is a small minded assumption that equates a job or excellence in sport to superiority in all things.  Football players are not the best athletes or human beings.  Cops are not the best humans nor are police dogs the best dogs.  Excellent show line dogs when mated to excellent workiline dogs produce excellent offspring.  Poor quality working line dogs produce poor quality offspring and poor quality working line dogs mated to poor quality show line will likely produce poor quality offspring.  The sire and dam predict what their offspring will be not titles or labels.